What Have You Learned About The Philippines

[UZI]

Tom,You said:

I think the people reading are not being given enough credit as to their ability to decide for themselves.

If only one POV is put forward and stated that it is a FACT, then no, how can they? That is why, as Mr Lee said, a 'balanced' view is needed. Some people come to forums as blank pages, looking for guidance & advise & we should think about how someone who, perhaps has never left their home town to live anywhere else, may view what we write.When I lived in Hong Kong, I was warned by a colleague, that ALL Filipinas were only after one thing - my passport. Thank God I didn't listen & followed my instincts otherwise I wouldn't have married Dee 12 years ago :thumbsup:Uzi.

[Singers]

Tom,You said:

I think the people reading are not being given enough credit as to their ability to decide for themselves.

If only one POV is put forward and stated that it is a FACT, then no, how can they? That is why, as Mr Lee said, a 'balanced' view is needed. Some people come to forums as blank pages, looking for guidance & advise & we should think about how someone who, perhaps has never left their home town to live anywhere else, may view what we write.When I lived in Hong Kong, I was warned by a colleague, that ALL Filipinas were only after one thing - my passport. Thank God I didn't listen & followed my instincts otherwise I wouldn't have married Dee 12 years ago :thumbsup:Uzi.

Scuzzi Uzi,When my post is (was) deleted how can that be reconciled with giving a "Balanced view" ??? My comment was innocuous. !!! ?I do know where you are coming from - though! "did he Peak in RR country".. :th_noproblem: Now!! TOM!!!UK Tom

[Singers]

Tom,You said:

I think the people reading are not being given enough credit as to their ability to decide for themselves.

If only one POV is put forward and stated that it is a FACT, then no, how can they? That is why, as Mr Lee said, a 'balanced' view is needed. Some people come to forums as blank pages, looking for guidance & advise & we should think about how someone who, perhaps has never left their home town to live anywhere else, may view what we write.When I lived in Hong Kong, I was warned by a colleague, that ALL Filipinas were only after one thing - my passport. Thank God I didn't listen & followed my instincts otherwise I wouldn't have married Dee 12 years ago :thumbsup:Uzi.

Dee DeeDee Dee Dee, Uzi.The power of Wommenzz Texy tex -- ahh the power of women. Thank God.I tell Cristina she only married me for my PassPort -- she replies "Listen to yourself and pal's talk about UK sometime".I tell her she only married me for my money -- she replies "What money -- you are a poor OLD Man" ! with a "D" in the middle ...Like BossMan -- Just cant WIN!!UK Tom

[Mr Lee]

Nice thread. Although at times has strayed a bit OT, thanks to the mods / admins for not shutting it down. Allowing a little latitude in interaction between members (even when people have opinions that differ with our own or are even controversial) is very good for creating a vibrant forum environment. My earlier post in this thread mentioned one of the many positives I've experienced, the incredible beauty of the scuba diving environments. Now to offer something from a bit of the other perspective (although hopefully this one won't be seen as too negative).I think the idea that the Philippines is "an English speaking country" is really over sold. My personal experience is that for a great percentage of the population, English is taught in school and outside the school environment, used rarely. Many in the province don't speak English on a regular basis at all. Of course English is often the third language for Filipinos after Tagalog (or Filipino) and their local dialect. On my first couple of visits I was very surprised by how uncomfortable "regular people" like drivers, shop workers, hotel workers, people I'd come across at the beach or in a club would be with speaking English and in some cases how poor their English skills actually were. Of course many do speak English fluently. Not a bad thing, just not what I expected after hearing how the Philippines was "an English speaking country".

F3 your comment is right on IMO and not negative at all. Telling the truth as we find it is not negative as long as we state it as such. What I have learned about the Philippines is that many Filipinos like to act like they understand because of the face issue, and therefore we think they understand what we said because they say they do, and the fact is that some do not but are afraid to say so, and that is when some problems can come about. I thank you for bringing this to the forum and I hope others can stay on topic and discuss things we have learned and maybe expand to how they may affect us.

[lobo]

soooo uzi.. thats a lot of impressive quotes and stats and %s , but my point wasnt to say the americans have or are exclusively supporting the fils.. it was a post about why the filipinos dont smile and not intended to be a pi ing contest between countries.. tho im happy that the uk is also involved in development in the fils even to a great extent than america if that is so..IMO most of the funds and technology that have been pumped into the fils post american occupation have been either squandered or just plain stolen and the citizens dont benefit at the numbers they should..many of the projects put into print here are for show and never even get started .. not meaning your stats about the brits projects specifically.. as you have all of the stats and facts i would like to know what % of the people here are living in poverty and what %tile holds the most wealth.. sure there are pockets of hi standard of living and beauty replete with expensive homes and cars and wealthy spoiled teens , but that is not the reality for the majority of the people.. and with all of the projects for improvements in this country i have to say something is very wrong.. i have landed where i am for a number of reasons , but i prefer this location to the wealthy communities i have visited . i have the means to live anyplace i want , but i am a common man and i prefer common people.. besides ,some of the wealthy people i know are as big a liars as the poor people i know... quote me please.. i would bet that we westerners have seen more of the country and experienced more here than the typical pinay and have a better perspective on the life here than most of them .. that has been my experience in my talks with the filipinos i have met.. the fact is and yes it is a fact.. i know more about the history of the fils than any pinay i have talked to.. they just dont care i think.. in palawan they still catch the chinese fishermen poisoning the corals to capture tropical fish and it is rapidly killing the corals... thats in the news if you can believe it. i dont dare quote it as fact.. find me a new state of the art sewage treatment plant... show me im wrong.. i want to be wrong.. id love to see any of the new landfills that all of these generous countries have paid for .. not just the U.S.The war and occupation by the United States would change the cultural landscape of the islands, as the people dealt with an estimated 34,000 - 1,000,000 casualties, disestablishment of the Catholic Church as the state religion, and the introduction of the English language as the primary language of government and some businesses. In 1916, the United States granted the Philippines autonomy and promised eventual self-government, which came in 193434000- 1,000,000 ? pheww a big spread, but what does this mean to you and me? is it an accusation and an explanation as to why the pinays are the way they are?? america never enslaved the fils like the spanish did.. and the japanese and the chinese.. anyway i dont understand what that quote is saying.. sorry..as many of us have often heard in our respective countries : the people are not the government and the government is not the people.. meaning people are the same wherever you go .. some good some bad.. but only the ones being served by the current powers are representative of that government.. not the population..the people in any given area are and should be expected to be representative of the general population nationwide.. exclusive of pockets of wealth.. unlike some here i make it my business to pry into the business of local officials and politicians at every chance ,as it gives me the insight i need to understand the people better and it furthers my education in what i have found is a very complicated network of subtle nuances which abound ,to the actual down and dirty business of greasing the palm.. an art and a dance of stealth i am learning.. i share these same thoughts with the people i meet everyday and i dont get the backlash from them that i get here.. i get shared concerns and opened eys and minds and an appreciation for wanting to know about the people and their plight.. the general replies to my questions about WHY is that the gov had done it to the people and the people are doing to each other and the circle grows.. people have to eat and just plain survive and their methods are learned behavior.. they didnt learn it from the americans btw.. it is a nation that doesnt even have time or the opportunity for that matter to evolve into a united nation because of its leadership and the people are being left behind.. you see so many fiestas because its the only way for the towns to say HEY , HERE WE ARE.. WE EXIST TOO... they are trying.. they see the same things we see , but we complain and dont like it.. they dont like it , but they dont complain, because then they are targets.. and i know if i push too hard , too far , too fast, i will be a target too.. i apologize for rambling and going so far off this post.. uzi... i like your stat talents.. i dont have the patience for it , but ill find the histories that i would like you to read.. they are all actual writings and excerpts from the catholic daily logs 17-1800s ?? dont quote me yet on that date.. ;)tnx for your time..i know this is rambling and im sorry.. i hope my words help me explain my other words.. i truly am not negative and i see many posts that when asked opinions or experiences accused of negativity when actually it is the simple relating of that persons experience.. dont ask if you dont want to hear i say..

[Singers]

soooo uzi.. thats a lot of impressive quotes and stats and %s , but my point wasnt to say the americans have or are exclusively supporting the fils.. it was a post about why the filipinos dont smile and not intended to be a pi ing contest between countries.. tho im happy that the uk is also involved in development in the fils even to a great extent than america if that is so..IMO most of the funds and technology that have been pumped into the fils post american occupation have been either squandered or just plain stolen and the citizens dont benefit at the numbers they should..many of the projects put into print here are for show and never even get started .. not meaning your stats about the brits projects specifically.. as you have all of the stats and facts i would like to know what % of the people here are living in poverty and what %tile holds the most wealth.. sure there are pockets of hi standard of living and beauty replete with expensive homes and cars and wealthy spoiled teens , but that is not the reality for the majority of the people.. and with all of the projects for improvements in this country i have to say something is very wrong.. i have landed where i am for a number of reasons , but i prefer this location to the wealthy communities i have visited . i have the means to live anyplace i want , but i am a common man and i prefer common people.. besides ,some of the wealthy people i know are as big a liars as the poor people i know... quote me please.. i would bet that we westerners have seen more of the country and experienced more here than the typical pinay and have a better perspective on the life here than most of them .. that has been my experience in my talks with the filipinos i have met.. the fact is and yes it is a fact.. i know more about the history of the fils than any pinay i have talked to.. they just dont care i think.. in palawan they still catch the chinese fishermen poisoning the corals to capture tropical fish and it is rapidly killing the corals... thats in the news if you can believe it. i dont dare quote it as fact.. find me a new state of the art sewage treatment plant... show me im wrong.. i want to be wrong.. id love to see any of the new landfills that all of these generous countries have paid for .. not just the U.S.The war and occupation by the United States would change the cultural landscape of the islands, as the people dealt with an estimated 34,000 - 1,000,000 casualties, disestablishment of the Catholic Church as the state religion, and the introduction of the English language as the primary language of government and some businesses. In 1916, the United States granted the Philippines autonomy and promised eventual self-government, which came in 193434000- 1,000,000 ? pheww a big spread, but what does this mean to you and me? is it an accusation and an explanation as to why the pinays are the way they are?? america never enslaved the fils like the spanish did.. and the japanese and the chinese.. anyway i dont understand what that quote is saying.. sorry..as many of us have often heard in our respective countries : the people are not the government and the government is not the people.. meaning people are the same wherever you go .. some good some bad.. but only the ones being served by the current powers are representative of that government.. not the population..the people in any given area are and should be expected to be representative of the general population nationwide.. exclusive of pockets of wealth.. unlike some here i make it my business to pry into the business of local officials and politicians at every chance ,as it gives me the insight i need to understand the people better and it furthers my education in what i have found is a very complicated network of subtle nuances which abound ,to the actual down and dirty business of greasing the palm.. an art and a dance of stealth i am learning.. i share these same thoughts with the people i meet everyday and i dont get the backlash from them that i get here.. i get shared concerns and opened eys and minds and an appreciation for wanting to know about the people and their plight.. the general replies to my questions about WHY is that the gov had done it to the people and the people are doing to each other and the circle grows.. people have to eat and just plain survive and their methods are learned behavior.. they didnt learn it from the americans btw.. it is a nation that doesnt even have time or the opportunity for that matter to evolve into a united nation because of its leadership and the people are being left behind.. you see so many fiestas because its the only way for the towns to say HEY , HERE WE ARE.. WE EXIST TOO... they are trying.. they see the same things we see , but we complain and dont like it.. they dont like it , but they dont complain, because then they are targets.. and i know if i push too hard , too far , too fast, i will be a target too.. i apologize for rambling and going so far off this post.. uzi... i like your stat talents.. i dont have the patience for it , but ill find the histories that i would like you to read.. they are all actual writings and excerpts from the catholic daily logs 17-1800s ?? dont quote me yet on that date.. ;)tnx for your time..i know this is rambling and im sorry.. i hope my words help me explain my other words.. i truly am not negative and i see many posts that when asked opinions or experiences accused of negativity when actually it is the simple relating of that persons experience.. dont ask if you dont want to hear i say..

Excellent Lobo,Tell it like it is.I find the "constrictions" quite tedious IMO indicative of very small minds.UK Tom Edited May 20, 2010 by Singers

[UZI]

soooo uzi.. thats a lot of impressive quotes and stats and %s , but my point wasnt to say the americans have or are exclusively supporting the fils.. it was a post about why the filipinos dont smile and not intended to be a pi ing contest between countries.. tho im happy that the uk is also involved in development in the fils even to a great extent than america if that is so..IMO most of the funds and technology that have been pumped into the fils post american occupation have been either squandered or just plain stolen and the citizens dont benefit at the numbers they should..many of the projects put into print here are for show and never even get started .. not meaning your stats about the brits projects specifically.. as you have all of the stats and facts i would like to know what % of the people here are living in poverty and what %tile holds the most wealth.. sure there are pockets of hi standard of living and beauty replete with expensive homes and cars and wealthy spoiled teens , but that is not the reality for the majority of the people.. and with all of the projects for improvements in this country i have to say something is very wrong.. i have landed where i am for a number of reasons , but i prefer this location to the wealthy communities i have visited . i have the means to live anyplace i want , but i am a common man and i prefer common people.. besides ,some of the wealthy people i know are as big a liars as the poor people i know... quote me please.. i would bet that we westerners have seen more of the country and experienced more here than the typical pinay and have a better perspective on the life here than most of them .. that has been my experience in my talks with the filipinos i have met.. the fact is and yes it is a fact.. i know more about the history of the fils than any pinay i have talked to.. they just dont care i think.. in palawan they still catch the chinese fishermen poisoning the corals to capture tropical fish and it is rapidly killing the corals... thats in the news if you can believe it. i dont dare quote it as fact.. find me a new state of the art sewage treatment plant... show me im wrong.. i want to be wrong.. id love to see any of the new landfills that all of these generous countries have paid for .. not just the U.S.The war and occupation by the United States would change the cultural landscape of the islands, as the people dealt with an estimated 34,000 - 1,000,000 casualties, disestablishment of the Catholic Church as the state religion, and the introduction of the English language as the primary language of government and some businesses. In 1916, the United States granted the Philippines autonomy and promised eventual self-government, which came in 193434000- 1,000,000 ? pheww a big spread, but what does this mean to you and me? is it an accusation and an explanation as to why the pinays are the way they are?? america never enslaved the fils like the spanish did.. and the japanese and the chinese.. anyway i dont understand what that quote is saying.. sorry..as many of us have often heard in our respective countries : the people are not the government and the government is not the people.. meaning people are the same wherever you go .. some good some bad.. but only the ones being served by the current powers are representative of that government.. not the population..the people in any given area are and should be expected to be representative of the general population nationwide.. exclusive of pockets of wealth.. unlike some here i make it my business to pry into the business of local officials and politicians at every chance ,as it gives me the insight i need to understand the people better and it furthers my education in what i have found is a very complicated network of subtle nuances which abound ,to the actual down and dirty business of greasing the palm.. an art and a dance of stealth i am learning.. i share these same thoughts with the people i meet everyday and i dont get the backlash from them that i get here.. i get shared concerns and opened eys and minds and an appreciation for wanting to know about the people and their plight.. the general replies to my questions about WHY is that the gov had done it to the people and the people are doing to each other and the circle grows.. people have to eat and just plain survive and their methods are learned behavior.. they didnt learn it from the americans btw.. it is a nation that doesnt even have time or the opportunity for that matter to evolve into a united nation because of its leadership and the people are being left behind.. you see so many fiestas because its the only way for the towns to say HEY , HERE WE ARE.. WE EXIST TOO... they are trying.. they see the same things we see , but we complain and dont like it.. they dont like it , but they dont complain, because then they are targets.. and i know if i push too hard , too far , too fast, i will be a target too.. i apologize for rambling and going so far off this post.. uzi... i like your stat talents.. i dont have the patience for it , but ill find the histories that i would like you to read.. they are all actual writings and excerpts from the catholic daily logs 17-1800s ?? dont quote me yet on that date.. ;)tnx for your time..i know this is rambling and im sorry.. i hope my words help me explain my other words.. i truly am not negative and i see many posts that when asked opinions or experiences accused of negativity when actually it is the simple relating of that persons experience.. dont ask if you dont want to hear i say..

1. I have not said that what you have said is not true2. I have not said your experiences are not valid.3. I have acknowledged your reality & that of many Filipino.3. What I have said is that it is not the only reality here.4. I have not compared the gap between the Rich & the poor but pointed out a growing & thriving MIDDLE class which you seem to want to ignore. This is where real change is happening here.Unlike many Filipino's, Americans in Chicago or New Orleans or Inner city kids in England or the millions in Africa, India, Bangladesh, Myanmar etc etc....we do have a choice of where we live. Would I change the lot of the average Filipino if I could..of course. Can I in reality...no. Can I fit in to the community...yes. Can I help the people I meet day on day...where & when I can yes. Millions of $ were sent to Haiti year after year but the bulk never got to the people due to corruption. This isn't just a Philippine issue.You are entitled to make grand statements & I am entitled to challenge those statements as you are entitled to do the same to me. I choose to support my statements with the source of that info. Just don't play the injured American card , we can all read your original post, it isn't relevant to this thread. WE are Expats all & this is about an EXPATS POV on what we have learned here. Like you said "not intended to be a pi ing contest between countries"Are there injustices here..of course but can we change them ...no. Only the Filipino's can. There are problems in ALL countries.Uzi.

[UZI]

soooo uzi.. thats a lot of impressive quotes and stats and %s , but my point wasnt to say the americans have or are exclusively supporting the fils.. it was a post about why the filipinos dont smile and not intended to be a pi ing contest between countries.. tho im happy that the uk is also involved in development in the fils even to a great extent than america if that is so..IMO most of the funds and technology that have been pumped into the fils post american occupation have been either squandered or just plain stolen and the citizens dont benefit at the numbers they should..many of the projects put into print here are for show and never even get started .. not meaning your stats about the brits projects specifically.. as you have all of the stats and facts i would like to know what % of the people here are living in poverty and what %tile holds the most wealth.. sure there are pockets of hi standard of living and beauty replete with expensive homes and cars and wealthy spoiled teens , but that is not the reality for the majority of the people.. and with all of the projects for improvements in this country i have to say something is very wrong.. i have landed where i am for a number of reasons , but i prefer this location to the wealthy communities i have visited . i have the means to live anyplace i want , but i am a common man and i prefer common people.. besides ,some of the wealthy people i know are as big a liars as the poor people i know... quote me please.. i would bet that we westerners have seen more of the country and experienced more here than the typical pinay and have a better perspective on the life here than most of them .. that has been my experience in my talks with the filipinos i have met.. the fact is and yes it is a fact.. i know more about the history of the fils than any pinay i have talked to.. they just dont care i think.. in palawan they still catch the chinese fishermen poisoning the corals to capture tropical fish and it is rapidly killing the corals... thats in the news if you can believe it. i dont dare quote it as fact.. find me a new state of the art sewage treatment plant... show me im wrong.. i want to be wrong.. id love to see any of the new landfills that all of these generous countries have paid for .. not just the U.S.The war and occupation by the United States would change the cultural landscape of the islands, as the people dealt with an estimated 34,000 - 1,000,000 casualties, disestablishment of the Catholic Church as the state religion, and the introduction of the English language as the primary language of government and some businesses. In 1916, the United States granted the Philippines autonomy and promised eventual self-government, which came in 193434000- 1,000,000 ? pheww a big spread, but what does this mean to you and me? is it an accusation and an explanation as to why the pinays are the way they are?? america never enslaved the fils like the spanish did.. and the japanese and the chinese.. anyway i dont understand what that quote is saying.. sorry..as many of us have often heard in our respective countries : the people are not the government and the government is not the people.. meaning people are the same wherever you go .. some good some bad.. but only the ones being served by the current powers are representative of that government.. not the population..the people in any given area are and should be expected to be representative of the general population nationwide.. exclusive of pockets of wealth.. unlike some here i make it my business to pry into the business of local officials and politicians at every chance ,as it gives me the insight i need to understand the people better and it furthers my education in what i have found is a very complicated network of subtle nuances which abound ,to the actual down and dirty business of greasing the palm.. an art and a dance of stealth i am learning.. i share these same thoughts with the people i meet everyday and i dont get the backlash from them that i get here.. i get shared concerns and opened eys and minds and an appreciation for wanting to know about the people and their plight.. the general replies to my questions about WHY is that the gov had done it to the people and the people are doing to each other and the circle grows.. people have to eat and just plain survive and their methods are learned behavior.. they didnt learn it from the americans btw.. it is a nation that doesnt even have time or the opportunity for that matter to evolve into a united nation because of its leadership and the people are being left behind.. you see so many fiestas because its the only way for the towns to say HEY , HERE WE ARE.. WE EXIST TOO... they are trying.. they see the same things we see , but we complain and dont like it.. they dont like it , but they dont complain, because then they are targets.. and i know if i push too hard , too far , too fast, i will be a target too.. i apologize for rambling and going so far off this post.. uzi... i like your stat talents.. i dont have the patience for it , but ill find the histories that i would like you to read.. they are all actual writings and excerpts from the catholic daily logs 17-1800s ?? dont quote me yet on that date.. ;)tnx for your time..i know this is rambling and im sorry.. i hope my words help me explain my other words.. i truly am not negative and i see many posts that when asked opinions or experiences accused of negativity when actually it is the simple relating of that persons experience.. dont ask if you dont want to hear i say..

Excellent Lobo,Tell it like it is.I find the "constrictions" quite tedious IMO indicative of very small minds.UK Tom

Hey...I resemble that remark.....

[Singers]

soooo uzi.. thats a lot of impressive quotes and stats and %s , but my point wasnt to say the americans have or are exclusively supporting the fils.. it was a post about why the filipinos dont smile and not intended to be a pi ing contest between countries.. tho im happy that the uk is also involved in development in the fils even to a great extent than america if that is so..IMO most of the funds and technology that have been pumped into the fils post american occupation have been either squandered or just plain stolen and the citizens dont benefit at the numbers they should..many of the projects put into print here are for show and never even get started .. not meaning your stats about the brits projects specifically.. as you have all of the stats and facts i would like to know what % of the people here are living in poverty and what %tile holds the most wealth.. sure there are pockets of hi standard of living and beauty replete with expensive homes and cars and wealthy spoiled teens , but that is not the reality for the majority of the people.. and with all of the projects for improvements in this country i have to say something is very wrong.. i have landed where i am for a number of reasons , but i prefer this location to the wealthy communities i have visited . i have the means to live anyplace i want , but i am a common man and i prefer common people.. besides ,some of the wealthy people i know are as big a liars as the poor people i know... quote me please.. i would bet that we westerners have seen more of the country and experienced more here than the typical pinay and have a better perspective on the life here than most of them .. that has been my experience in my talks with the filipinos i have met.. the fact is and yes it is a fact.. i know more about the history of the fils than any pinay i have talked to.. they just dont care i think.. in palawan they still catch the chinese fishermen poisoning the corals to capture tropical fish and it is rapidly killing the corals... thats in the news if you can believe it. i dont dare quote it as fact.. find me a new state of the art sewage treatment plant... show me im wrong.. i want to be wrong.. id love to see any of the new landfills that all of these generous countries have paid for .. not just the U.S.The war and occupation by the United States would change the cultural landscape of the islands, as the people dealt with an estimated 34,000 - 1,000,000 casualties, disestablishment of the Catholic Church as the state religion, and the introduction of the English language as the primary language of government and some businesses. In 1916, the United States granted the Philippines autonomy and promised eventual self-government, which came in 193434000- 1,000,000 ? pheww a big spread, but what does this mean to you and me? is it an accusation and an explanation as to why the pinays are the way they are?? america never enslaved the fils like the spanish did.. and the japanese and the chinese.. anyway i dont understand what that quote is saying.. sorry..as many of us have often heard in our respective countries : the people are not the government and the government is not the people.. meaning people are the same wherever you go .. some good some bad.. but only the ones being served by the current powers are representative of that government.. not the population..the people in any given area are and should be expected to be representative of the general population nationwide.. exclusive of pockets of wealth.. unlike some here i make it my business to pry into the business of local officials and politicians at every chance ,as it gives me the insight i need to understand the people better and it furthers my education in what i have found is a very complicated network of subtle nuances which abound ,to the actual down and dirty business of greasing the palm.. an art and a dance of stealth i am learning.. i share these same thoughts with the people i meet everyday and i dont get the backlash from them that i get here.. i get shared concerns and opened eys and minds and an appreciation for wanting to know about the people and their plight.. the general replies to my questions about WHY is that the gov had done it to the people and the people are doing to each other and the circle grows.. people have to eat and just plain survive and their methods are learned behavior.. they didnt learn it from the americans btw.. it is a nation that doesnt even have time or the opportunity for that matter to evolve into a united nation because of its leadership and the people are being left behind.. you see so many fiestas because its the only way for the towns to say HEY , HERE WE ARE.. WE EXIST TOO... they are trying.. they see the same things we see , but we complain and dont like it.. they dont like it , but they dont complain, because then they are targets.. and i know if i push too hard , too far , too fast, i will be a target too.. i apologize for rambling and going so far off this post.. uzi... i like your stat talents.. i dont have the patience for it , but ill find the histories that i would like you to read.. they are all actual writings and excerpts from the catholic daily logs 17-1800s ?? dont quote me yet on that date.. ;)tnx for your time..i know this is rambling and im sorry.. i hope my words help me explain my other words.. i truly am not negative and i see many posts that when asked opinions or experiences accused of negativity when actually it is the simple relating of that persons experience.. dont ask if you dont want to hear i say..

Excellent Lobo,Tell it like it is.I find the "constrictions" quite tedious IMO indicative of very small minds.UK Tom

Hey...I resemble that remark.....

Nah Uzi,You got yours from me months ago when you "came out" along the lines of "Discernment and Wit" with a dollop of common sense.No change in my thinking there.... :thumbsup:UK Tom

[lobo]

soooo uzi.. thats a lot of impressive quotes and stats and %s , but my point wasnt to say the americans have or are exclusively supporting the fils.. it was a post about why the filipinos dont smile and not intended to be a pi ing contest between countries.. tho im happy that the uk is also involved in development in the fils even to a great extent than america if that is so..IMO most of the funds and technology that have been pumped into the fils post american occupation have been either squandered or just plain stolen and the citizens dont benefit at the numbers they should..many of the projects put into print here are for show and never even get started .. not meaning your stats about the brits projects specifically.. as you have all of the stats and facts i would like to know what % of the people here are living in poverty and what %tile holds the most wealth.. sure there are pockets of hi standard of living and beauty replete with expensive homes and cars and wealthy spoiled teens , but that is not the reality for the majority of the people.. and with all of the projects for improvements in this country i have to say something is very wrong.. i have landed where i am for a number of reasons , but i prefer this location to the wealthy communities i have visited . i have the means to live anyplace i want , but i am a common man and i prefer common people.. besides ,some of the wealthy people i know are as big a liars as the poor people i know... quote me please.. i would bet that we westerners have seen more of the country and experienced more here than the typical pinay and have a better perspective on the life here than most of them .. that has been my experience in my talks with the filipinos i have met.. the fact is and yes it is a fact.. i know more about the history of the fils than any pinay i have talked to.. they just dont care i think.. in palawan they still catch the chinese fishermen poisoning the corals to capture tropical fish and it is rapidly killing the corals... thats in the news if you can believe it. i dont dare quote it as fact.. find me a new state of the art sewage treatment plant... show me im wrong.. i want to be wrong.. id love to see any of the new landfills that all of these generous countries have paid for .. not just the U.S.The war and occupation by the United States would change the cultural landscape of the islands, as the people dealt with an estimated 34,000 - 1,000,000 casualties, disestablishment of the Catholic Church as the state religion, and the introduction of the English language as the primary language of government and some businesses. In 1916, the United States granted the Philippines autonomy and promised eventual self-government, which came in 193434000- 1,000,000 ? pheww a big spread, but what does this mean to you and me? is it an accusation and an explanation as to why the pinays are the way they are?? america never enslaved the fils like the spanish did.. and the japanese and the chinese.. anyway i dont understand what that quote is saying.. sorry..as many of us have often heard in our respective countries : the people are not the government and the government is not the people.. meaning people are the same wherever you go .. some good some bad.. but only the ones being served by the current powers are representative of that government.. not the population..the people in any given area are and should be expected to be representative of the general population nationwide.. exclusive of pockets of wealth.. unlike some here i make it my business to pry into the business of local officials and politicians at every chance ,as it gives me the insight i need to understand the people better and it furthers my education in what i have found is a very complicated network of subtle nuances which abound ,to the actual down and dirty business of greasing the palm.. an art and a dance of stealth i am learning.. i share these same thoughts with the people i meet everyday and i dont get the backlash from them that i get here.. i get shared concerns and opened eys and minds and an appreciation for wanting to know about the people and their plight.. the general replies to my questions about WHY is that the gov had done it to the people and the people are doing to each other and the circle grows.. people have to eat and just plain survive and their methods are learned behavior.. they didnt learn it from the americans btw.. it is a nation that doesnt even have time or the opportunity for that matter to evolve into a united nation because of its leadership and the people are being left behind.. you see so many fiestas because its the only way for the towns to say HEY , HERE WE ARE.. WE EXIST TOO... they are trying.. they see the same things we see , but we complain and dont like it.. they dont like it , but they dont complain, because then they are targets.. and i know if i push too hard , too far , too fast, i will be a target too.. i apologize for rambling and going so far off this post.. uzi... i like your stat talents.. i dont have the patience for it , but ill find the histories that i would like you to read.. they are all actual writings and excerpts from the catholic daily logs 17-1800s ?? dont quote me yet on that date.. ;)tnx for your time..i know this is rambling and im sorry.. i hope my words help me explain my other words.. i truly am not negative and i see many posts that when asked opinions or experiences accused of negativity when actually it is the simple relating of that persons experience.. dont ask if you dont want to hear i say..

1. I have not said that what you have said is not true2. I have not said your experiences are not valid.3. I have acknowledged your reality & that of many Filipino.3. What I have said is that it is not the only reality here.4. I have not compared the gap between the Rich & the poor but pointed out a growing & thriving MIDDLE class which you seem to want to ignore. This is where real change is happening here.Unlike many Filipino's, Americans in Chicago or New Orleans or Inner city kids in England or the millions in Africa, India, Bangladesh, Myanmar etc etc....we do have a choice of where we live. Would I change the lot of the average Filipino if I could..of course. Can I in reality...no. Can I fit in to the community...yes. Can I help the people I meet day on day...where & when I can yes. Millions of $ were sent to Haiti year after year but the bulk never got to the people due to corruption. This isn't just a Philippine issue.You are entitled to make grand statements & I am entitled to challenge those statements as you are entitled to do the same to me. I choose to support my statements with the source of that info. Just don't play the injured American card , we can all read your original post, it isn't relevant to this thread. WE are Expats all & this is about an EXPATS POV on what we have learned here. Like you said "not intended to be a pi ing contest between countries"Are there injustices here..of course but can we change them ...no. Only the Filipino's can. There are problems in ALL countries.Uzi.

injured american card?? hahahahahaha wtf?? not relevant , but relevant enough to warrant ranting... the posts i see all run off on tangents..rather, many that i see... take a pill..im done...