Rich American, Poor American

[Dave Hounddriver]

I rent my apartment for 10,500 per month ...... all the tenants pay either 10,500p for a 2 bedroom or 7,500p for a 1 bedroom apart

This part reminded me of a 4 plex unit I rented at Liloan, Cebu. The rent was 10K for all tenants but locals said it was too much. They said filipinos would only pay 7K for a place like that.The end result was that 3 of the units were rented by foreigners and the 4th was empty, until one of those filipina scammers moved in with her boyfriend, grown kids, grandkids, chickens, and online American paying the bill for her.It did not take long for the foreigners to start moving out. Eventually the landlord saw the error of her ways and evicted the scammer but the damage was done. I was the last to leave the 4 plex, 9 months ago. I just heard that all the units are still vacant, waiting for more foreigners to come and pay 10K for a 7K apartment. (For the sake of argument they could probably rent out the units for more than 7, less than 10 but the fact they seem to all be vacant speaks for itself.)

[i am bob]

Bob ..... I know it is kinda hard to explain or you to visualize just what we mean but try this example ....... I rent my apartment for 10,500 per month ...... all the tenants pay either 10,500p for a 2 bedroom or 7,500p for a 1 bedroom apart ...... now that is including profit for the owner at the rate he set or he couldn't stay in business ...... now just supposedly he should decide that he wants foreigners to pay more for his apartments but Filipinos still pay the normal rate ..... so he ups the price to 12,500 for foreigners ...... he is still making his normal profit but he is now getting 200p per month more just because he is a foreigner ...... now some will say well ... it is his business he can charge what he wants ..... very true ..... but that still doesn't make it right ..... and I guess you can't blame a feller for trying ....... but I have the right to look else where ..... and I would ...... there are Filipinos living in our building that make more money than I do so why wouldn't they pay they same ...... if a local showed up to rent a apartment and could only afford 8,500p per month for a 2 bedroom apartment do you think he would lower the price for them ...... absolutely not ...... that is why they have a set price for items and everyone is happy .....Although a haircut at 40p seems very cheep to you just remember you aren't going to get the type of haircut you are currently used to ..... and again they are making a profit or they wouldn't stay in business ...... we keep reverting back to barbers and they are really a bad example to be comparing this issue with .....My tailor charges me 500p to make my shorts (we supply the material) ..... his rent for his shop is 1500p per month and he lives in a room at the back (we asked him) ..... he may or may not pay for his electricity (could be pirated) so if he just sews 4 pairs of shorts a week he makes 8000p per month ...... now I know I pay a bit more cause I'm a bit bigger that the average Filipino :) so it takes longer to make mine ..... but when my asawa was shopping around for tailors she found several that quoited her a price of 400p but when she took them a pair of my shorts to copy the first thing they said is "OOOO a kano" and the price went to 1200p ...... so because of their greediness they lost our business ..... our current tailor has made me 4 pairs of shorts now and will be doing more in the future and I recommend him to anyone looking for a tailor ..... so who lost out in the long run ......Bob I'm not picking on you .......... when you get here you can do what you want .... but I think once you get here and settled in you will see what we are talking about ......... my best advise is to let the little woman handle your negations ..... just don't let your pride get in the way ..... some guys insist they have to pay for everything and then bitch when they pay to much ..... course if your single ya got mo choice ....... :mocking: :welcome: :hystery: :hystery: ........ IMHO

Mike, I agree with you on those who are just being greedy. They don't deserve our business but those are not the ones I'm referring to either. Let me try an example.When you get groceries you have 2 basic places to go - either a chain grocery store or the wet market (just for this example of course)Who has a locals price and higher price for some others - the wet marketWho has a set price - the chain storeWho has the higher price - the chain storeWho will barter - the wet marketWho gets the better wholesale price - the chain storeWho makes the bigger profit per item purchased - the chain storeUsing the above, where would someone making minimum low wages shop? Obviously the wet market. The prices will be lower so that this person can afford to shop there or the wet market may give them a lower price because they know they won't get the sale without it. Yet it may cost the wet market more than the chain store for the product (assuming same supplier for the product) so his profit is well below the chain store. So, since his prices aren't locked in, when he has a chance to charge a little more to help his bottom line, he will try to charge more. Now if he is honest, we should be able to barter him back to a reasonable and fair price compared to his cost of the product. At the chain store, the price is higher so you are being "ripped off" even more than the wet market.Now is this a realistic model? There are lots of holes in my example but I did it this way to keep it as simple for comparison as possible (ie: the wet market will have a local supply hopefully cheaper than the chain's) I wanted to keep this small and simple. And yes, many people will try and rip you off but those are not the people I'm talking about. And one thing everybody is forgetting,,, I'm not saying that doing this is right! I'm just agreeing with JJR that this is something that is going to happen and that I can understand why it happens and an example as the one I gave. And if they don't fit into that category, then I will rate them as greedy and they will not get my business.

[Art2ro]

This topic title should have been "Rich & Middle Class Americans vs Poor Filipinos, Local Merchants and Scammers" and nothing mentioned about "Poor Americans", because that's what being discussed here pertaining to the Kano price vs the Filipino price! This has been going on for ages from the haggling/barter system of old and still continues to this day in the Philippines mostly in small towns, provinces and some cities and suburbs that have wet & dry open markets and or surplus shops (ukay ukay Filipino style)! It's all in the name of tourism, supply and demand, if one looks like a foreigner, one will pay the foreigner price unless the price is posted for all and if not as a foreigner, you're fair game by the local merchants and scammers! That's just the way it is here and some other countries!

Edited February 17, 2012 by Art2ro

[i am bob]

This topic title should have been "Rich & Middle Class Americans vs Poor Filipinos, Local Merchants and Scammers" and nothing mentioned about "Poor Americans", because that's what being discussed here pertaining to the Kano price vs the Filipino price! This has been going on for ages from the haggling/barter system of old and still continues to this day in the Philippines mostly in small towns, provinces and some cities and suburbs that have wet & dry open markets and or surplus shops (ukay ukay Filipino style)! It's all in the name of tourism, supply and demand, if one looks like a foreigner, one will pay the foreigner price unless the price is posted for all and if not as a foreigner, you're fair game by the local merchants and scammers! That's just the way it is here and some other countries!

That's one thing that nobody on here has talked about! It's like nobody but the Philippines has a muti-tier pricing and barter system. It's absolutely amazing how many countries work exactly the same way!

[Bundy]

This topic title should have been "Rich & Middle Class Americans vs Poor Filipinos, Local Merchants and Scammers" and nothing mentioned about "Poor Americans", because that's what being discussed here pertaining to the Kano price vs the Filipino price! This has been going on for ages from the haggling/barter system of old and still continues to this day in the Philippines mostly in small towns, provinces and some cities and suburbs that have wet & dry open markets and or surplus shops (ukay ukay Filipino style)! It's all in the name of tourism, supply and demand, if one looks like a foreigner, one will pay the foreigner price unless the price is posted for all and if not as a foreigner, you're fair game by the local merchants and scammers! That's just the way it is here and some other countries!

:mocking: Well said Art, happens all over the world, not just in the Philippines.The problem is just magnified when you have a tourist from a first world country visiting a third world country.My answer to the whole thing is.........if you don't like the price, then DON"T pay it! you are free to walk away.Perhaps if enough of us did this then we wouldn't be having this discussion. Edited February 17, 2012 by Bundy

[JJReyes]

If it's the same price for everyone I wouldn't even try. But that's a world of difference from deliberately overcharging someone because of their skin color, nationality, or perceived ability to pay.

There is also merit in MikeB's position. The ideal situation is a single price system. I think what everyone finds irritating is there are different prices for most things in the Philippines. In the United States, the haggling appears to be limited to large ticket items like buying a new or used car. Yet even this is a losing battle. When was the last anyone won against a car salesman? Whatever I paid, I just know deep down they overcharged me. Edited February 17, 2012 by JJR

[Art2ro]

If it's the same price for everyone I wouldn't even try. But that's a world of difference from deliberately overcharging someone because of their skin color, nationality, or perceived ability to pay.

There is also merit in MikeB's position. The ideal situation is a single price system. I think what everyone finds irritating is there are different prices for most things in the Philippines. In the United States, the haggling appears to be limited to large ticket items like buying a new or used car. Yet even this is a losing battle. When was the last anyone won against a car salesman? Whatever I paid, I just know deep down they overcharged me.

Here we go again not mentioning anything about the "Poor American" who probably doesn't a have nickle in his pockets, let alone be able to haggle over the price of a new or used beat up car! All he can afford is his KADALAKAD (not Cadillac), which means his foot mobile in the Tagalog dialect! :welcome: :mocking: Edited February 17, 2012 by Art2ro

[Jollygoodfellow]

. we keep reverting back to barbers and they are really a bad example to be comparing this issue with .....

Corn Flakes,corn flakes are the only way to compere anything. A Chinese professor who once posted here,Mr Dot Lee came up with a formula that is now used by the expat community world wide for comparing costs. Corn Flakes hmm yep Corn Flakes. :dance:For those new members who don't get the concept of this little bit of a joke,forget it but older members will probably know what its about.Now someone reprimand me for going off topic. :mocking: :welcome:

[Dave Hounddriver]

Here we go again not mentioning anything about the "Poor American" who probably doesn't a have nickle in his pockets,

Not sure about others but I only know a very few "Poor Americans" and thought I had covered that in post 4. What else is there to say:

I have not found that to be the case. In the few (3) instances I know where the foreigners (1 American, 1Aussie, 1 German) live as filipinos (that means no income other than what they can earn at jobs such as street cleaning or similar), I notice local people observing them like nobility who have fallen from grace. In other words they are still seen as rich, but rich who have lost or squandered all their money.

[Tatoosh]

Actually, the cornflakes comparison of costs is a variation of The Economist magazine's Big Mac Index. That has been in use since 1986 to ... "provide a test of the extent to which market exchange rates result in goods costing the same in different countries. It 'seeks to make exchange-rate theory a bit more digestible'".