POGO article

[scott h]

short article about Pogoes in todays paper, might be a puff piece,,,,,,,,,but

https://www.philstar.com/business/2019/08/15/1943379/what-i-saw-inside-pogo-hub

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There’s a mini grocery selling imported Chinese goods — from cigarettes, crackers and softdrinks, to sanitary napkins and what-have-you. There are living quarters with several dorm-type rooms and their bunk beds. There are smoking areas and wide open spaces; lots of greenery, too. There are nipa huts and an al fresco dining and drinking area that can accommodate hundreds.

And then there are the offices. The office spaces are similar to call centers—nothing out of the ordinary. If not for the Chinese employees, one might confuse the offices as just a regular BPO or call center office.

This is what I saw during a recent visit to a POGO hub, a few minutes away from Manila. The hub is already operating, but is only partially open. The rest of the sprawling estate is still under construction. POGO stands for Philippine offshore gaming operator.

Basically, the so-called POGO hub refers to a piece of real estate with buildings and structures dedicated to offshore gaming companies and their service providers. 

Inside the BPO buildings are telemarketers, call center agents, IT, accounting and other back office support. The offices aren’t cramped, although they are not sparingly designed either -- typical of most BPO setups. They have airconditioning too and proper lighting.

Live, work, play

In a nutshell, a POGO hub is just like any other IT/technology hub or industrial park that caters to a particular industry. While POGO hubs follow the “live, work, play” concept, all foreign and Filipino employees working there have complete freedom of movement, says the operator.

I didn’t stay long enough to see what the mostly Chinese employees do at the end of a typical office work day, whether they actually go out of the hub, or just stay inside and have some tea, banter over drinks, or just go back to their bunk beds. But I saw some employees buying food and other items in the Chinese grocery in between office hours.

The operator says that all workers can take free company shuttles or any public transportation to any place they wish to go to like malls and cinemas during their day off. 

Furthermore, the operator says that contrary to misconceptions, a POGO hub is not some kind of prison for foreign or Filipino workers. A hub’s greatest advantage, in fact, is the presence of government representative offices to ensure full compliance with Philippine immigration, labor and tax regulations. I didn’t see the Filipino officials during my visit, but I’m told that they would be there.

Disclaimer

Of course my knowledge of a POGO hub is only as good as my access, but from what I saw during my visit, I can attest that these hubs are just like the usual mixed-use communities.

In fact, some economic zones I’ve visited in the provinces seemed more restricting to workers.

I actually like the idea of having POGO hubs, if only to contain the creeping Chinese influx in the country.

I say this with no intention to discriminate against Chinese nationals. In fact, let me share with you that I have some Chinese friends from the mainland — different from my Filipino-Chinese friends — and we would chat over lunch or dinner once in a while and I can say that they have been kind to me and I enjoy their company.

But I also know that the cultural differences are prevalent. Some find them impossibly loud, obnoxious, untidy and so on. I have heard complaints from condo residents about their noisy and rowdy Chinese neighbors.

Policymakers should, therefore, appreciate PAGCOR’s desire to better regulate POGOs. They thought of POGO hubs because of complaints of cultural clashes. 

The hubs are designed to put them in one area without restricting their freedom of movement. 

In fact, POGO hubs may be the best solution yet to the growing POGO-related problems in the country.

Read more at https://www.philstar.com/business/2019/08/15/1943379/what-i-saw-inside-pogo-hub#VYEZHkPwOkb6dZQ3.99

[Tommy T.]

Thanks for the information... interesting...

[OnMyWay]

They are finally starting to crack down on some of these POGOs for not paying taxes.

https://business.inquirer.net/279778/bir-shuts-tax-dodging-pogo-service-provider

I thought it was funny that at the Subic Bay closing, they had a little ceremony, like "Grand Closing"!  I took this pic from our chairwoman's FB page.  She is the one in the center.  This building is next to my kid's school and I did not realize it was being used for POGO.

[graham59]

I don't see these as being a positive contribution to the Philippines and the Filipino people...except of course to the usual (criminal) suspects.  It appears to me to be about control, corruption, and exploitation, by outsiders who have no interest whatsoever in the culture and welfare of their hosts....let alone respecting their laws,  as per the Chinese involvement in certain African countries.

I disapprove of gambling anyway.  

[scott h]

6 hours ago, graham59 said:

I don't see these as being a positive contribution to the Philippines and the Filipino people

IMHO if I was in charge, if I was looking for foreign investment, I would much prefer a POGO than let a foreign company come in and strip mine the back country. 

6 hours ago, graham59 said:

positive contribution

Moving away from POGOs to the foreign financed casinos here in Manila. We went to Okada's (huge Japanese owned resort) for a couple of hours yesterday. These were my personal contacts with Filipinos working there.  I dropped my wife off at the main entrance, (comfort room emergency lol) Main gait met by 2 security guards and 1 dog handler, at the main door her door was opened by  1 valet. Drove to another entrance, 2 guards and a different dog handler. Directed to the parking area by no less than 3 security guards. Parked and entered the casinos entrance 4 security guards and 1 exray machine operator. Went looking for the wife and nodded to 2 security guards at the divide between the mall and the casino. Met the wife and went to the customer service kiosk where 1 young lady helped my wife redeem her points. Went to the rest room and bumped into 1 janitor. Escorted the wife to her slot machine and asked 1 waitress for a coffee. Asked 1 slot machine attendant about a promotion they had going on. Onse the wife was absorbed lol, made my way to my personal vise the kraps table. Greeted by 4 English fluent dealers. I was there for shift change and 4 new English fluent dealers.  After an hour went to the cashiers cage to change my chips to paper money and dealt with 1 cashier. Found the wife left the casino where the door was opened by 1 security guard. Drove out of the parking lot past 2 other security guards.

In a 90 minute visit at a conservative estimate I personally made contact with 31 Filipino citizens who have jobs due to a foreign owned casino.

7 hours ago, graham59 said:

I disapprove of gambling anyway.

As a young man I had problem with alcohol and haven't drank in over 25 years. But even though I no longer drink booze I still see how many folks do and how many jobs are created and maintained for every bottle of Red Horse bought at the local Sari-Sari store    

[Marvin Boggs]

The concept of POGO is a good one in my opinion.  The implementation of it seems to be a problem.  

One hub where people can live, work, and play is a really nice concept pioneered in China.  I lived in a similar setup for about 18 months.  It eliminates most trips you need to take, and allows you to live without a car.  They tend to be clean, safe, well managed, and convenient.  

However, implementing them here with almost exclusive Chinese workers seems like a huge problem.  Foreigners should be integrated into society, not given their own separate enclaves, a hard lesson that we still haven't learned in the US.  Another huge problem is the report of some of these 'workers' looking suspiciously military.  PH could be essentially paving the way for sleeper cells of the Chinese military, to put it bluntly.  

 

[graham59]

2 hours ago, scott h said:

IMHO if I was in charge, if I was looking for foreign investment, I would much prefer a POGO than let a foreign company come in and strip mine the back country. 

Moving away from POGOs to the foreign financed casinos here in Manila. We went to Okada's (huge Japanese owned resort) for a couple of hours yesterday.

As a young man I had problem with alcohol and haven't drank in over 25 years. But even though I no longer drink booze I still see how many folks do and how many jobs are created and maintained for every bottle of Red Horse bought at the local Sari-Sari store    

I fail to see the relevance of your response.  You say it was a Japanese resort you visited...and what has alcohol consumption to do with it ?   

[Tommy T.]

12 minutes ago, graham59 said:

I fail to see the relevance of your response.  You say it was a Japanese resort you visited...and what has alcohol consumption to do with it ?   

Perhaps I am wrong here, Graham, but I think Scott is making the point that alcohol sales also employ people. Not sure if that is supposed to include at the casino/resort but, either way I can see that alcohol sales, like gambling, require people so there are jobs created?

[scott h]

22 minutes ago, graham59 said:

and what has alcohol consumption to do with it ?

 

6 minutes ago, Tommy T. said:

Perhaps I am wrong here, Graham, but I think Scott is making the point that alcohol sales also employ people

Thanks Tommy,,,,

[OnMyWay]

3 hours ago, Tommy T. said:

Perhaps I am wrong here, Graham, but I think Scott is making the point that alcohol sales also employ people. Not sure if that is supposed to include at the casino/resort but, either way I can see that alcohol sales, like gambling, require people so there are jobs created?

Those two points are not really relevant to the POGO discussion.  Sure, vice industries create many jobs, and make huge companies trillions of dollars.  Alcohol, tobacco, gambling, prostitution, drugs......  They all invite crime and corruption to a neighborhood near you.  Does that mean I am against all of them.  No, but I do have mixed feelings about several.

POGO is a different animal all together.  For the most part, it has nothing to do with the Philippine casinos.  The POGO offices are support for online gambling, and a high percentage of the workers are imported foreign workers.  A Filipino is not even allowed to gamble online.  Nor is a Chinese, Indonesian or Malaysian citizen.  This online gambling is illegal for most of the gamblers participating.

As I have mentioned before, China holds the key to all of this, and with that key, they hold tremendous power over the Philippines.  China can end it all rather easily and that would create a big economic problem for the Philippines.  So, for letting it continue, do you think they are getting something in return?  No, not China.  The government there is just nice people trying to do the right thing.

The whole military conspiracy concept is another discussion, but I worry that there is something to it.  I see some of the POGO workers in my neighborhood.  Many walk daily to keep fit.  Some, but not all, certainly do have a military look; 20-30 years old, short haircuts, very fit, big muscles.  It is not the image in my mind of what a typical Chinese office worker or recruit from rural areas would look like.  However, I admit I really don't know enough about it.

Edited September 28, 2019 by OnMyWay
grammer