13A Leaving the country for a while....

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OzeMike
Posted
Posted
59 minutes ago, Huggybearman said:

Yes, not just 7 visits to the UK from the Philippines, but numerous (20 plus) times to Thailand where we used to live between 2011 and 2015. Strange we never heard of this seminar. All of those times we were boyfriend/girlfriend as we only got married in 2019. We never had a single issue with her leaving the Philippines. Some of the trips to Thailand were solo trips for her as I had permanent residence there but she was limited to 30 days in Thailand each visit.  She would occasionally return to the Philippines on her own to take care of her farming business. 
 

Possibly it might have been something to do with her age that she never encountered a problem, as when we first exited the Philippines she was in her early 30’s. That age might be outside of the profile of someone who was likely to be trafficked.

I understood the seminar and the resultant sticker in your wife/gf's passport was only if she was going to live in your country.

My gf on an Australian defacto visa had to attend the seminar when she moved with me to live in Oz. 

But for a tourist visa there before that I don't remember her needing the seminar. It was a long time ok so things may have changed...or my memory is getting shot :bonk:

 

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OnMyWay
Posted
Posted
On 3/31/2022 at 4:56 AM, Clermont said:

I'm pretty sure she will have to do a seminar and get her passport stamped for getting out of the country. Make sure your wife knows ALOT ABOUT YOU AND YOUR FAMILY it is a safe guard against her being trafficked, also don't leave it until the last minute as a lot fail and have to go back and redo the test. :cheersty:

On 3/31/2022 at 5:48 AM, BrettGC said:

As Clermont said, the anti-trafficking seminar thing may or may not happen but best to prepare.  My wife had to do it the first time she visited me in Australia, despite having travelled the world before we even met.  

 

On 3/31/2022 at 9:34 AM, Shol said:

Thanks Dave.  We are only aware at this point of the one everyone mentioned on here for the trafficking safeguard however will be looking at it all to make sure so we don't get told to pound it at the airport for some nonsense I was too dumb to factor in :)

Thanks!

I'm getting confused.  If Shol's wife is on a tourist visa, what seminar would she take?

@BrettGC Was your wife on a tourist visa when she visited you?  If so, what seminar did she take?  As far as I know, CFO does not give seminars to tourists.

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Dave Hounddriver
Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, OnMyWay said:

If Shol's wife is on a tourist visa, what seminar would she take?

Quote

 

1.  What are travel requirements for Philippine citizens with tourist-purpose visas?

Unexpired DFA-issued passport (at least six-months valid)
Unexpired visa (if visa-required at final destination); and
Return ticket. 

2. When are additional documents required?

Consistent with anti-human trafficking, -human smuggling, and -illegal recruitment laws, additional documents shall be required after (1), when:

a. Passenger discloses a doubtful, false or suspect travel intent;

b. Passports and travel documents/visas are counterfeit, fraudulent, falsified, simulated or tampered; and

c. Passenger’s totality of circumstances manifests a well-founded certainty of human trafficking, smuggling or illegal recruitment.

2.1. What are considered under 2(c)?

Age/Health;
Educational attainment;
Financial capability for travel;
Travel history, if any; and
Final destination.

3. What are documents required for sponsored-travel?

a. Philippine Embassy or consulate-authenticated Affidavit of Support with Undertaking showing:

4th civil degree of consanguinity relationship between sponsor and the passenger, e.g., pinsang buo or affinity, e.g., bayaw/hipag/biyenan);
Sponsor’s financial capacity and legal status; and
Sponsor’s contact information; and/or

b. Philippine Embassy or consulate-authenticated Affidavit of Support with Undertaking showing:

Sponsor’s financial capacity and legal status;
Sponsor’s contact details; and

c. Sponsor’s corporate registration papers, if applicable.

d. In cases of a local sponsor traveling with the passenger, a duly notarized Affidavit of Support and Undertaking which shall contain the following:

Sponsor’s financial capacity;
Sponsor’s undertaking is for passenger’s tourist travel with intent to return;
Sponsor’s complete residential address of the sponsor and contact details; and
Sponsor’s corporate registration papers, if applicable.

 

Here is the legalese of it. Link is https://immigration.gov.ph/faqs/travel-req

So if judged under 2a or 2c then additional documents may be required.  This is Philippines.  Its how things are done here.

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BrettGC
Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, OnMyWay said:

I'm getting confused.  If Shol's wife is on a tourist visa, what seminar would she take?

@BrettGC Was your wife on a tourist visa when she visited you?  If so, what seminar did she take?  As far as I know, CFO does not give seminars to tourists.

It was before we were married so that may have triggered it?  It was a few years ago now on her old passport, I'll ask her when she wakes up. 

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Shol
Posted
Posted

Can't really complain here you guys are all over it and with this form there is **no** chance I should be unprepared to leave :)

Anyway appreciate all the insights and thought.

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OnMyWay
Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Dave Hounddriver said:

So if judged under 2a or 2c then additional documents may be required.  This is Philippines.  Its how things are done here.

Yes, that applies to a certain scenario, which is not the topic.  I can think of 3 main scenarios for Filipinas:

A.  Married Filipina exiting Philippines for the first time with her husband on a tourist visa  (Shol)

B.  Married Filipina leaving Philippines PERMANENTLY with or without  her husband on an immigrant visa.  This requires CFO seminar.

C.  Any Filipino leaving Philippines on a tourist trip.

A. and C. have a slight overlap, but not much.  A. and C. do not have any seminars.   Some are telling Shol that his wife needs a seminar.  What seminar, I ask?

 I had written another post last night but did not post after I saw Brett's post.

2 hours ago, OzeMike said:

I understood the seminar and the resultant sticker in your wife/gf's passport was only if she was going to live in your country.

My gf on an Australian defacto visa had to attend the seminar when she moved with me to live in Oz. 

But for a tourist visa there before that I don't remember her needing the seminar. It was a long time ok so things may have changed...or my memory is getting shot :bonk:

 

Correct.  I think some are getting two subjects mixed up.

4 hours ago, hk blues said:

Just to be sure - Your wife has exited the Philippines numerous times, including relatively recently, and has never been asked for proof of attendance for the seminar. 

I wonder if any members' wife's have had to show the proof or is it something required only for women exiting alone and permanently?

Using the U.S. as an example (but I think others are similar) when a Filipina emigrates she of course has to have a U.S. immigrant visa.  Most of the time this is a marriage visa, IR1 or CR1 (already married) or a K1 fiancé visa.  When exiting Philippines, BI looks at the passport, and there will either be tourist visa or an immigrant visa.  If they see the immigrant visa, there must be proof of CFO.  CFO does not give seminars to tourists.

Do Filipinas get hassled at the border and even offloaded?  YES!  But that is not about CFO, it is a different subject.  BI will question many Filipinas who fit a certain profile, such as one or more of these:

1.  Young with no travel experience.

2.  Going to a non-visa required country like most of SE Asia.

3.  Traveling alone or with a much older man.

4.  Poor and / or uneducated

5.  No strong ties to the Philippines, like a job

6.  Single

7.  Dressed in an unusually sexy outfit.

If the tourist has a tourist visa to a visa required country like the U.S. and Canada, Philippines BI will consider that but it is no guarantee that they will let the Filipina go.  BI has the final say at the border.

A married Filipina traveling alone on a tourist visa, for the first time, going out of the country, might get stopped for questions.  The first question will be, why are you travelling without your husband?  That is the only time I can think of where a married Filipina should be prepared for explaining.

Travelling together, as husband and wife, for the first time, you should still be prepared for questions and have documents.  On all of our trips, I bring our marriage cert, birth certs for whole family, etc.

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OnMyWay
Posted
Posted
23 hours ago, ExtraThree said:

Regarding the ridiculous CFO two methods of proof now work. One or both gets her thru. (PDF download of certificate of completion or actual physical sticker). Nice improvement in that regard since PDF is instantly sent on completion and not physically mailed. 👍🏻

Yes, one good thing to come out of the Covid situation.  CFO indicates that this is the new normal but who knows if it will be permanent.  When and if we migrate to the U.S., I will have to check again for my wife.  She has a certificate but no stamp in passport.

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hk blues
Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, OnMyWay said:

Yes, that applies to a certain scenario, which is not the topic.  I can think of 3 main scenarios for Filipinas:

A.  Married Filipina exiting Philippines for the first time with her husband on a tourist visa  (Shol)

B.  Married Filipina leaving Philippines PERMANENTLY with or without  her husband on an immigrant visa.  This requires CFO seminar.

C.  Any Filipino leaving Philippines on a tourist trip.

A. and C. have a slight overlap, but not much.  A. and C. do not have any seminars.   Some are telling Shol that his wife needs a seminar.  What seminar, I ask?

 I had written another post last night but did not post after I saw Brett's post.

Correct.  I think some are getting two subjects mixed up.

Using the U.S. as an example (but I think others are similar) when a Filipina emigrates she of course has to have a U.S. immigrant visa.  Most of the time this is a marriage visa, IR1 or CR1 (already married) or a K1 fiancé visa.  When exiting Philippines, BI looks at the passport, and there will either be tourist visa or an immigrant visa.  If they see the immigrant visa, there must be proof of CFO.  CFO does not give seminars to tourists.

Do Filipinas get hassled at the border and even offloaded?  YES!  But that is not about CFO, it is a different subject.  BI will question many Filipinas who fit a certain profile, such as one or more of these:

1.  Young with no travel experience.

2.  Going to a non-visa required country like most of SE Asia.

3.  Traveling alone or with a much older man.

4.  Poor and / or uneducated

5.  No strong ties to the Philippines, like a job

6.  Single

7.  Dressed in an unusually sexy outfit.

If the tourist has a tourist visa to a visa required country like the U.S. and Canada, Philippines BI will consider that but it is no guarantee that they will let the Filipina go.  BI has the final say at the border.

A married Filipina traveling alone on a tourist visa, for the first time, going out of the country, might get stopped for questions.  The first question will be, why are you travelling without your husband?  That is the only time I can think of where a married Filipina should be prepared for explaining.

Travelling together, as husband and wife, for the first time, you should still be prepared for questions and have documents.  On all of our trips, I bring our marriage cert, birth certs for whole family, etc.

It's a long post so I'll focus on the A B C part only.

For A - It's a bit ambiguous.  Do you mean leaving the Philippines for the 1st time or for the 1st time as a married woman? My wife exited a couple of times before marriage but has not since we married. How would this apply to her - Let's assume it was purely for a trip? Maybe this is Shols case - exited before as a couple but not a married couple so next exit would be 1st as a married couple. Seminar required?

B- clear

C - clear but may be the same as A in many cases.

If you are right that A and C require no seminar I wonder why DFA advised my wife she needed to attend before renewing her passport even though no travel was planned? A friend's wife faced the same requirement and did it whilst my wife refused and nothing more was said.

Also, I thought the seminar was required only for Filipinas married to a foreigner I.e. not single Filipinas? Sure, other requirements would exist for them but not the seminar?

 

 

 

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OnMyWay
Posted
Posted (edited)
56 minutes ago, hk blues said:

See below

It's a long post so I'll focus on the A B C part only.

For A - It's a bit ambiguous.  Do you mean leaving the Philippines for the 1st time or for the 1st time as a married woman? My wife exited a couple of times before marriage but has not since we married. How would this apply to her - Let's assume it was purely for a trip? Maybe this is Shols case - exited before as a couple but not a married couple so next exit would be 1st as a married couple. Seminar required?

It doesn't really matter in your case.  CFO seminar is only required when somebody emigrates permanently.  If she is a tourist, you should just bring backup documents in case they have question.  You have a kid too so that makes it easier.  If she is travelling alone, there might be more questions.

B- clear

C - clear but may be the same as A in many cases.

Yes, as I mentioned, there could be some overlap, but no seminar.

If you are right that A and C require no seminar I wonder why DFA advised my wife she needed to attend before renewing her passport even though no travel was planned? A friend's wife faced the same requirement and did it whilst my wife refused and nothing more was said.

Also, I thought the seminar was required only for Filipinas married to a foreigner I.e. not single Filipinas? Sure, other requirements would exist for them but not the seminar?

Correct.  As I mentioned, DFA did the same for my wife and since then I have found that DFA is incorrect.  They probably assume incorrectly that the name change on the passport means they are emigrating.

My wife has never been asked for CFO when going overseas because she probably doesn't fit the profile they are looking for, like the things I mentioned in the other post.

First "tourist" trip to U.S. was for business in 2008.  She got a 10 year B1/B2 visa.

Second tourist trip was to visit me in the U..S. before were married in 2012.  We were worried but prepared for questions.

All other trips were together and with at least two kids.  Never any questions.

Now, we planned for her and my stepdaughter to emigrate to the U.S.  When we leave for good, they would need proof of the CFO seminar.  Unfortunately, those plans are on hold.

Regarding A and C overlap, here is a scenario where a Filipina wife might get a lot of questions at immigration.

Wife is very young.  Husband is very old.

Wife is travelling alone without previous travel experience, or very little.

Wife is dressed like a bargirl.

Etc,,,,,,,

No offense intended to anyone, that is just reality.

 

 

 

 

Edited by OnMyWay
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Dave Hounddriver
Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, OnMyWay said:

Yes, that applies to a certain scenario, which is not the topic.

Had you clicked on the link I posted, it covers every possible scenario, but I bow to your experience and wisdom in the matter.

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