Canadian Becomes A Filipino Citizen

[BrettGC]

5 minutes ago, Dave Hounddriver said:

I understand the point now.  However, as Mike J stated:

So it looks like more of a formality for the foreigner to renounce their original citizenship.  It would be entirely impractical for a Canadian to do that.  They would not be able to visit Canada on a Philippine passport.  My brother in Australia found that out.  He is dual Aus/Can citizenship and Canadian immigration would not let him come back to Canada on his Aus passport because he was still considered a Canadian citizen and requires a Canadian Passport to re-enter the country.  For LINK click here.

Same in Australia, I have to enter on my Aussie passport.  Why your brother wouldn't enter Canada on his Canadian passport is a bit odd?  Expired perhaps?  Express lanes are good. 

[Major Tom]

2 hours ago, Mike J said:

The Philippines does require a person to renounce their other citizenship.  However, that renunciation carries zero weight with their home country and they DO NOT lose their citizenship.   I don't think I will be following a blog of someone who doesn't know what the hell they are talking about. 

<snip>

To renounce U.S. citizenship, you must voluntarily and with the intent to relinquish U.S. citizenship:
appear in person before a U.S. consular or diplomatic officer, in a foreign country (normally at a U.S. Embassy or Consulate);
sign an oath of renunciation.
pay a $2,350.00 fee

 

<end snip>

 

<snip>

You can voluntarily renounce your Canadian Citizenship provided

you do not currently live in Canada
you are a citizen of a country (or countries) other than Canada in addition to being a Canadian citizen so that, when you renounce, you will still have citizenship of that other country (or countries)
you are at least 18 years of age
you are capable of understanding the significance of renouncing your citizenship.

<end snip>

 

 

As far as a U.S. citizen renouncing their citizenship:
 

Can you still live in the US if you renounce your citizenship?

 

When you renounce citizenship, you lose the right to live and work in the U.S. You will not be able to vote in U.S. elections. You will not be entitled to the protection of the United States overseas. You will no longer be able to enter the U.S. and remain indefinitely.

 

https://www.taxesforexpats.com › gi...

Giving Up US Citizenship and the Exit Tax - What You Need To Know

[Mike J]

3 minutes ago, Major Tom said:

As far as a U.S. citizen renouncing their citizenship:
 

Can you still live in the US if you renounce your citizenship?

 

When you renounce citizenship, you lose the right to live and work in the U.S. You will not be able to vote in U.S. elections. You will not be entitled to the protection of the United States overseas. You will no longer be able to enter the U.S. and remain indefinitely.

 

https://www.taxesforexpats.com › gi...

Giving Up US Citizenship and the Exit Tax - What You Need To Know

As I wrote in my earlier post.  Renouncing your USA citizenship to Philippine authorities to become a Philippine citizen DOES NOT, in and of itself, cause you to lose your USA citizenship.

[Major Tom]

Just now, Mike J said:

As I wrote in my earlier post.  Renouncing your USA citizenship to Philippine authorities to become a Philippine citizen DOES NOT, in and of itself, cause you to lose your USA citizenship.

Do you have any documentation to support your assertion? Please provide. Thanks.

[Mike J]

2 minutes ago, Major Tom said:

Do you have any documentation to support your assertion? Please provide. Thanks.

https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/travel-legal-considerations/Advice-about-Possible-Loss-of-US-Nationality-Dual-Nationality/Dual-Nationality.html#:~:text=A U.S. citizen may naturalize,they wish to do so.

<snip>

U.S. law does not mention dual nationality or require a person to choose one nationality or another. A U.S. citizen may naturalize in a foreign state without any risk to his or her U.S. citizenship. However, persons who acquire a foreign nationality after age 18 by applying for it may relinquish their U.S. nationality if they wish to do so. In order to relinquish U.S. nationality by virtue of naturalization as a citizen of a foreign state, the law requires that the person must apply for the foreign nationality voluntarily and with the intention to relinquish U.S. nationality. Intent may be shown by the person’s statements and conduct.

<end snip>

[Major Tom]

9 minutes ago, Mike J said:

Intent may be shown by the person’s statements and conduct.

If you US citizen publicly stated that they’ve become a citizen of a foreign state that required him or her to renounce their U.S. citizenship and said person is no longer a citizen of the U.S., wouldn’t that constitute renouncing their US citizenship with intent?

[Mike J]

6 minutes ago, Major Tom said:

If you US citizen publicly stated that they’ve become a citizen of a foreign state that required him or her to renounce their U.S. citizenship and said person is no longer a citizen of the U.S., wouldn’t that constitute renouncing their US citizenship with intent?

No it would not.  The requirements to renounce USA citizenship are very specific.  Telling a Philippine official that you are renouncing your citizenship fall WAY SHORT of those requirments.

https://md.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/renounce-citizenship/

<snip>

To renounce U.S. citizenship, you must voluntarily and with the intent to relinquish U.S. citizenship:

appear in person before a U.S. consular or diplomatic officer, in a foreign country (normally at a U.S. Embassy or Consulate);
sign an oath of renunciation.
pay a $2,350.00 fee.
On the day of your appointment, you will execute the following forms. You are advised to familiarize yourself with these forms prior to your interview.

Form DS-4079: Request for Determination of Possible Loss of United States Citizenship
Form DS-4080: Oath/Affirmation of the Renunciation of the Nationality of the United States(PDF 269 KB)
Form DS-4081: Statement of Understanding Concerning the Consequences and Ramifications of Renunciation or Relinquishment of U.S. Nationality(PDF 29 KB)
any other forms determined necessary to support your Loss of Nationality

<end snip>

[Dave Hounddriver]

51 minutes ago, BrettGC said:

Why your brother wouldn't enter Canada on his Canadian passport is a bit odd?  Expired perhaps?

Yes.  Expired and he did not realize he could not use his Aus passport for a visit.  His wife, traveling on her Aus passport, had to renounce her Canadian "permanent residence" status as well.  Apparently that's a thing.  She had used up her allotted time out of Canada so S.O.L  BUT given enough time she could have requested an extension before coming back to Canada.  It is well and truly screwed up, but that's just how things are.

[azntravlr]

From what I was told it is very hard for Americans to become Filipino nationals. The Philippines rarely grant citizenship to Americans. But Filipinos can have both. The American has to give up his citizenship to get a Filipino one. 
im not into Kyle he’s a pinoybaiter to me and he technically works for the Department of Tourism so it’s in their favor. 

[KC813]

Gaining and losing citizenship (at least under US law) is a fascinating subject with historical undertones.  With all the different laws dealing with citizenship, and different scenarios covered, the full range of laws become very complicated.  Without multi-quoting previous posts, here are some facts I find interesting.

 

Renunciation/expatriation - the process is just as Mike J says.  The law intends to make renunciation difficult.  As someone else said, the most common reason for renunciation is for tax purposes, but renunciation cannot be done within the US – except in a time of war.  After the assassination of President Kennedy, new expatriation requirements were added (Appendix XV of the Warren Commission Report is the long but detailed story about Lee Harvey Oswald’s renunciation attempts in Moscow).  Then there is the story of chess legend Bobby Fischer trying trying for renunciation to avoid extradition.  Also, another expatriation tidbid is that it is extremely difficult to abandon citizenship if it would leave you ‘stateless’. 

As MikeJ also showed, the Vblogger subject of this post did not automatically lose US citizenship by becoming a PH citizen, even if he claims he so intends.  He has to first jump through some daunting hoops.

Not all countries allow voluntary renunciation of citizenship.  The universal axiom is that a person is a citizen of any country that claims him as their citizen, whether the person wants to be or not.  Because of this, the person is subject to that other country’s legal requirements when in that other country.  If some country says that your US-born child is their citizen, that child is their citizen.  This can create many special problems, such as when the other country has a military conscription law and the teenage kid goes to that country to visit his grandparents.  Hello army!

About half of the countries of the world say that you are no longer a citizen if you take up citizenship in another country.  The other half still say you are their citizen.  As often mentioned, the Philippines have said that you lose citizenship - but you can get it back and be a multi-country citizen).  This issue comes up now and then in Philippine news:  “Is that congressman or department head really a Ph citizen, or still a US citizen?”  The written “renunciation” taken before assuming a high government position does not meet the renunciation requirements under US law, so they are still US citizens until they go through the formal procedure.  This might be the issue one of the Tulfo brothers has been facing for the last several months.

A completely different set of laws deals with passing on US citizenship to foreign-born kids.  Many on this board know this process well!  But what may be less known is that some 2^nd and 3^rd generation foreign-born persons are US citizens and do not no it.  Rare, but if the prior generation(s) met the transmission and retention requirements, it happens.

Okay, I’m rambling.  The laws are numerous, complicated, and change through the years, but still very interesting to see how a country’s history is intertwined with its citizenship laws.

 

(Before and during the Great War, US had a law that took away citizenship from some women who married foreigners.  Mostly repealed in the 1920's, coincidentally about the same time women were given the vote!)