Monkey see monkey do

[Clermont]

Over the last few months people have been posting posts about the laws being enforced in the PI's, were as in the past it was an acceptable practise. These laws were drawn up in the mid 40's but were never strictly enforced. Cast your mind back to your own country for a minute, is it acceptable to not wear a helmet, or flip flops while riding a bike of any description, or all in the car not wearing a seatbelt, down to unroadworthy vehicles, unlicensed driving and the list goes on. We don't like the strict laws in our own country, but we observe them, what is different in the PI's?

Then we have laws controlling land taxes and building taxes and anything associated when building your retirement home over there. The original laws were drawn up in the 40's, plenty of amendments since then. Many of us rely on the professionals we hire to sort these permits out for us, we all know this is not a reliable assumption over there as a cousin can do it cheaper than a qualified person. This is what I call, ( biting the nose off to spite the face, ) Sure it might cost more for a professional but in most cases they would have done their homework and got the correct permits, if not they can have their ticket pulled. 

Sometimes we overlook our paperwork or don't know the laws of the land and it can come back and bite us at a later date. I for one will be spending Peso's to invite the Barangay captain out for tea and run through the permits I need and informing him of my intentions and what else I need to live in the house I have built for our retirement. 

Saying that, it is not a foolproof scheme but at least it's a starting point and he knows you are generally trying to fit in and abide by PI laws.

[Jack Peterson]

7 minutes ago, Clermont said:

Then we have laws controlling land taxes and building taxes and anything associated when building your retirement home over there.

I thought it might be prudent to link this as it is a Pick a subject on Philippine Laws in the Section Marked PHILIPPINE LAWS 

http://laws.chanrobles.com/

[Clermont]

Thanks Jack, I read a lot of his articles, very informative. 

[Dave Hounddriver]

2 hours ago, Clermont said:

what is different in the PI's?

Good question and I shall give my personal opinion to that first paragraph.

We did not always have to wear helmets and seatbelts and steel-toed shoes in Canada.  That was a result of 2 things.  The first was a Nanny state deciding what is best for everyone and taking away personal choice.  The second excuse was the universal health care system.  It meant that taxpayers would have to pay for injuries to people who did not follow those laws and got in an accident.

So I heard about the freedom of Philippines and I moved here because it was different.  There was no Nanny state telling me every detail of how to live my life and I was free to make my own choices and pay for my own consequences.  Now the Philippines have cherry-picked certain laws to enforce in the Philippines without thought to the reasons behind them.  In short, they are putting the cart before the horse.  Get the workers on the streets wearing shoes as they mix concrete before worrying about whether some old foreigner busts his head open while not wearing a helmet, (without any consequences whatsoever to the Philippines or its people).

I notice the Philippines trying to copy first world laws in many places without the first world infrastructure to back it up.  You want people to wear helmets and other safety gear?  Then give free health care to those who get in accidents while following all those laws.  You want people to remove the LED add-on lights from their motorcycles?  Then put up adequate street lighting in all populated places where the motorcycle will have to travel at night. 

Fortunately, the Philippines still has a low cost of living and many locals speak English.  Inflation is slowly eroding the first benefit.  As to the second, other countries are learning English at ever increasing rates.  The Philippines is slowly changing, and not for the better IMHO.

End of 

EDIT:  Postscript, the helmet law in the Philippines only came into effect in the Motorcycle Helmet Act of 2009.  You will note in the link that the purpose is:
 

Quote

. . . to secure and safeguard its citizenry, particularly the operators or drivers of motorcycles and their passengers, from the ruinous and extremely injurious effects of fatal or life-threatening accidents and crashes.

Nanny State!

Edited September 26, 2018 by Dave Hounddriver

[Clermont]

 

1 hour ago, Dave Hounddriver said:

Nanny State!

I agree with the part about helmets not being in the original drafting, but as you quoted

 

1 hour ago, Dave Hounddriver said:

. to secure and safeguard its citizenry, particularly the operators or drivers of motorcycles and their passengers, from the ruinous and extremely injurious effects of fatal or life-threatening accidents and crashes.

Amendments to laws are a part of life, whether it be first, second or third world countries, now if you want to cut straw, nether were seat belts or blinkers and a lot of other modern day guismos that vehicles have on them. We could go through a whole lot of modern day safety devices, but at the end of the day, the amendments were passed by their government for the safety of innocent people. Don't forget, we are still visitors and when in Rome do as the Romans do. So as for one, I don't see a problem with the PI's starting to enforce their laws, we might even live longer. If I'm fined for an infringement, I no doubt will have a silent grumble but it is their country and I will be happy if their finally looking at western countries for a lead on lawlessness. The change might even catch onto more serious crime.  In the meantime, I'm going to sit back with this bloke and enjoy the popcorn and see how it all turns out. 

[JDDavao II]

Not sure I would want to live in a society that doesn't "socialize" scraping the bodies off of the road or that refuses to care for those with Traumatic Brain Injuries but to each his own.

[Dave Hounddriver]

2 hours ago, JDDavao said:

Not sure I would want to live in a society that doesn't "socialize" scraping the bodies off of the road or that refuses to care for those with Traumatic Brain Injuries but to each his own.

Hold on.  Don't you live in Philippines?  Have you ever been in the ICU when they have scraped someone up off the road after a motorcycle accident ) or getting run over by a Ceres bus) and brought them to the ICU?  Happens every day.  As far as I can tell the hospitals do immediate and necessary care to get the person past the crisis, and then they ask about money before deciding what else they can do.

I have spent a lot of time in Philippine hospitals.  Not so much for my own ailments but visiting others who are there.  I have seen doctors step over a baby who died of pneumonia on the floor of the hospital hallway as the family had no money.  I have seen people torn up from vehicular accidents treated in ICU as emergencies even if they have no money.

Point is you DO live in a society that refuses to care for those with traumatic brain injuries if they have no cash.  That is you do if you live in Philippines.

[JDDavao II]

I'm glad you got what you came for, then. 

[Queenie O.]

Hi Clermont,

I agree that laws are necessary and as has been expressed in other previous posts, it will take time to get citizens into the mindset that laws are there to protect people for the most part. As Dave said, the country lacks the infrastructure to police and enforce and put "teeth" some folks will follow the lines of least resistance because of lack of funds or just carelessness or not enough education on why particular laws are going to help them. Past and present abilities of bending or breaking laws by some individuals can sometimes make breaking laws that much easier.  I think that all we can do is follow the current laws ourselves, and try to be patient that the future success of consistent laws here will help and protect more citizens eventually  over time.

[Clermont]

7 hours ago, Queenie O. said:

Hi Clermont,

I agree that laws are necessary and as has been expressed in other previous posts, it will take time to get citizens into the mindset that laws are there to protect people for the most part. As Dave said, the country lacks the infrastructure to police and enforce and put "teeth" some folks will follow the lines of least resistance because of lack of funds or just carelessness or not enough education on why particular laws are going to help them. Past and present abilities of bending or breaking laws by some individuals can sometimes make breaking laws that much easier.  I think that all we can do is follow the current laws ourselves, and try to be patient that the future success of consistent laws here will help and protect more citizens eventually  over time.

Yes Queenie, where do they start with their laws, from the beginning it has been all corrupt and blind eyed but now the PI's have been focused on Asia sumits and they have seen the benefits of a law abiding society for tourists and their own people, they have come into the 21st century. No doubt it will take time, most probably more time than some of have got, but like I said where do they start.

There will be hiccups and grumbles from the public, but like a child taking their first step, you don't scold the child if the child falls over, it's encouragement you give it.

I believe if a foreigner is picked up on a legit violation, just smile and say sorry I won't do it again, they have the power to caution instead of fining you.

The last couple of times I've been over there I have seen a change in the wider society, from trying not to drop rubbish in the street to actually residing to the fact their car was going to be towed for illegal parking. These are the small kiddy steps I've witnessed and like I said, we might not be around to see the PI's running, but we are witnessing their first steps.

JGF posted a good post with a video of them cleaning up a street, I'll bet there are streets being cleaned up now and illegal structures being pulled down, and I'll bet it's not the authorities doing it. The old saying, give an inch and they'll take a mile comes to mind but now the illegal structures are being pushed back to what is legally their own property and no more.

My wife's son was talking on messenger walking to the train station and I asked him where all the street vendors were, " gone not allowed to set up stalls anymore,"

The infrastructure is not there for a lawful society but who would invest in a country with no will to change, personally, I think the kiddy steps are great.