An example of problems with land ownership

[Ynot]

5 minutes ago, Jack Peterson said:

Sorry , maybe I have missed something, To what ( which Post) are you referring my friend.

I was responding to this post about the possibility a squatter or tenant can delay being evicted or even obtain land ownership albeit they are not the rightful owners, and linking it to an earlier post I made about my future in-laws who have been given their marching orders to vacate land they have lived on for over 30 years (paying rent) as have many other families all who have built homes on the land because the land owner wants to use the land for something else.  I was concerned because I thought they may be forced off sooner rather than later.  So I suppose i was being a little sarcastic with my post. 

[robert k]

To GregZ, you know what you are getting into. I am posting for the people who don't have the foggiest notion of what they are up against. At the cost you are paying, if you live there for 5 years before the SHTF you were just paying rent in advance. Best of luck to you.

I come from a place where it is the norm to buy if you can. If things were otherwise, I would be looking to buy myself.

[GregZ]

On 4/7/2016 at 11:18 PM, robert k said:

To GregZ, you know what you are getting into. I am posting for the people who don't have the foggiest notion of what they are up against. At the cost you are paying, if you live there for 5 years before the SHTF you were just paying rent in advance. Best of luck to you.

I come from a place where it is the norm to buy if you can. If things were otherwise, I would be looking to buy myself.

I wish we were living there to get that "cheap rent ahead" benefit.  We leave Wednesday for USA.  Likely will have to stay there for a couple years.  People here on Cebu Island are supposed to "fix" this for us while we are gone.  Chance of that happening? Really? 20%, no 50-50 because I am an optimist.  LOL 

Really, the ones we will count on to do the leg work are not very skilled at these things.  They have already proven that.  They are WILLING but just failing on the ABLE part due to their ignorance.  (Ignorance is not meant offensively, just as an observation.  They have not had the opportunity of exposure to these matters.)  Also, the Filipino non-conflict attitude, especially with power figures, to deal with things makes it more challenging.

Right now the place sits empty and I think that we should find a family member or relative to move in and watch over the place.  At least someone would benefit and we would know if anything is going on with the property or nearby. 

This is only one property issue.  I have another.... even more complicated, but no money at risk, SO FAR.

To solve it requires the agreement of 7 households, roughly 60 persons, maybe more.  There are claims of debt against the property for the final expenses of the deceased owner.  What fun we will have now.  We are talking a straight up soap opera on this one.  Jealousy and the crab mentality will make it fun IF IT IS EVER DEALT WITH.  So far there was a meeting of the heads of the households and one with my lawyer.  Now, everyone is frozen in place.  No next step means we will never see the end.

Bottom line. EVERYONE looking to get involved with property; go in with your eyes open and do not be surprised when things are not as they appeared or when you cannot get folks to cooperate on a successful outcome.  This applies even if all will benefit, if it appears that one will benefit more than the others.  OH WELL.

I have learned a lot about the Philippines and the function of the Baranguay Hall, in Guadalupe, Cebu City anyway.  The hall has a meeting place where the meeting is recorded and kept for future reference regarding discussions and agreements made.  They also take all claims of dept and neighborly disputes there and try to resolve them at that level.  Very nice!  They really liked a foreigner coming to visit also.

[sonjack2847]

I found this and maybe it will help somebody in the future.

How to verify if the land title is authentic

The first step is to ask the seller for the photocopy of the TCT (Transfer Certificate of Title) or the title of the land that you are going to buy.
When you secure a copy, go to the Registry of Deeds where the land is registered and ask for “Certified True Copy” of the title. They will give a form where you can fill up, sometimes they will do it for you, they just need the Title number, the name of the property owner and the purpose why you want a copy, tell them or write into the request form that you want to buy the property.
Wait for your request to be assessed, check the transaction details that they prepare and pay the required processing fees indicated, around three hundred pesos (Php 300).
After paying, return your request paper with the assessment form and payment orders with the receipt to the window that will print for the certified true copy of the title.
Once, you secured a copy, compare the TCT copy that you get from the seller and the one that you get from the Registry of Deeds, all the details should match.
When you check and everything is the same, it means that the title is authentic and you can proceed with the transactions if you want the property.
Making all the papers double check particularly the title, will save you a large amount of money and a lot of trouble in the future if you don’t check it first hand. So make sure that everything is clear and clean before going to any agreement or transactions.

. 

[Dave Hounddriver]

46 minutes ago, sonjack2847 said:

found this and maybe it will help somebody in the future.

That's good information to know.  We just need to remember, from the link in the opening post, that "the Bouffard family was able to get a title of the land" but the local squatters are applying for an " annulment of title " so having title is still no guarantee of ownership.  This is Philippines

[earthdome]

On 4/9/2016 at 1:29 AM, GregZ said:

I have learned a lot about the Philippines and the function of the Baranguay Hall, in Guadalupe, Cebu City anyway.  The hall has a meeting place where the meeting is recorded and kept for future reference regarding discussions and agreements made.  They also take all claims of dept and neighborly disputes there and try to resolve them at that level.  Very nice!  They really liked a foreigner coming to visit also.

 

It all depends on your Barangay and its Barangay Captain. I also had a very good experience with the Barangay Captain resolving a dispute between me and a neighbor. The neighbor initiated the escalation to the Barangay but the issue was mediated in my favor. i.e. the Barangay Captain only acted as a mediator until the parties reached agreement. In my case it became clear to my neighbor that they had to concede in order to save face.

[RBM]

On 4/9/2016 at 6:29 PM, GregZ said:

I wish we were living there to get that "cheap rent ahead" benefit.  We leave Wednesday for USA.  Likely will have to stay there for a couple years.  People here on Cebu Island are supposed to "fix" this for us while we are gone.  Chance of that happening? Really? 20%, no 50-50 because I am an optimist.  LOL 

Really, the ones we will count on to do the leg work are not very skilled at these things.  They have already proven that.  They are WILLING but just failing on the ABLE part due to their ignorance.  (Ignorance is not meant offensively, just as an observation.  They have not had the opportunity of exposure to these matters.)  Also, the Filipino non-conflict attitude, especially with power figures, to deal with things makes it more challenging.

Right now the place sits empty and I think that we should find a family member or relative to move in and watch over the place.  At least someone would benefit and we would know if anything is going on with the property or nearby. 

This is only one property issue.  I have another.... even more complicated, but no money at risk, SO FAR.

To solve it requires the agreement of 7 households, roughly 60 persons, maybe more.  There are claims of debt against the property for the final expenses of the deceased owner.  What fun we will have now.  We are talking a straight up soap opera on this one.  Jealousy and the crab mentality will make it fun IF IT IS EVER DEALT WITH.  So far there was a meeting of the heads of the households and one with my lawyer.  Now, everyone is frozen in place.  No next step means we will never see the end.

Bottom line. EVERYONE looking to get involved with property; go in with your eyes open and do not be surprised when things are not as they appeared or when you cannot get folks to cooperate on a successful outcome.  This applies even if all will benefit, if it appears that one will benefit more than the others.  OH WELL.

I have learned a lot about the Philippines and the function of the Baranguay Hall, in Guadalupe, Cebu City anyway.  The hall has a meeting place where the meeting is recorded and kept for future reference regarding discussions and agreements made.  They also take all claims of dept and neighborly disputes there and try to resolve them at that level.  Very nice!  They really liked a foreigner coming to visit also.

What I am unable to understand as why would anyone except a masochist go ahead with any property purchase where the title is not 100% clear. This nonsense of lining up many relatives to sign whom may or may not agree just makes no sense.Also squatter issues.

If no clear title move on, even as in our case there was a clear title we paid for an independent official opinion to confirm same. If one is in love with the area concerned, organize a lease, do not make unending issues which normally end up not being decided in your favour.

[sonjack2847]

I have found out that my next door neighbor bought some land and it has now emerged that there is a long term tenant on there and he is trying to sort it out with the sellers.He could have done with the advice that is on here.