How Do You, Or Should You Try To Keep A Newbie Thinking Objectively

[Jake]

As usual, excellent thought provoking question Dzighnman! I've been a member of this forum for a little overtwo years now. This forum may not be perfect (what is these days) but there are many sincere advices foranyone visiting the Philippines. But like anything else, some members will try to read between the lines ormis-interpret the message. Some members may think they already have their ducks in a row and will refuseor ignore the warnings. Could it be different sitting down with a friend and having a man to man discussion? Does it really dependson how receptive the person might be, by allowing his ego to accept some constructive criticism? Will heapply lessons learned from previous failure(s) in home country (marriage, financial, etc) to improve himselfafter a mid-life crisis? I guess deep down, it all depends on the individual. All of us have traveled throughour own speed bumps along the way and survived, just like you Dzighnman.This forum is full of shared experiences, both sadness and successes. I'm especially grateful that memberslike OnMyWay, Curley, I am Bob and many more adventurers have found this forum and willing to share theirupcoming experiences. I know it will be tears of joy.......Respectfully -- Jake

[scott h]

For my part, I will offer my experiences, strength and hopes for the future at I see it. My Asawa and I met through a mutual friend and used snail mail to get to know each other (I know I am dating myself,,,and her also lol). Even though we have not actually become official expats, I feel I know enough to give advise WHEN ASKED FOR IT.A buddy of mine has been seeing a Filipinna he met on line for a couple of years now and makes the trip to the Phil about every 6 months. He to hopes to retire here. When we talk. "Where is she from?" "near Manila" he says. "Have you met her family?" "Not yet" is the answer RED FLAG! "have you been to her home town?" "Nope" RED FLAG. He asked me..."You think I can open a bar/restro? My fiances family would help run it" RED FLAG x2.I have given him the IP Addy for this forum,,,but as the saying goes you can lead a horse.....

[Bundy]

These days i will not offer advice because usually people are going to do what they want to do anyway, especially when they're blinded by some hot little body who is making them feel like a schoolboy again.All i will do is to try and make it known what can and does happen.If asked i will relate my own experiences.When i first came to the Philippines in 1986 i was given the lowdown from a really good mate, but i still made mistakes which cost me and i lived to regret.On the other side of the coin, there seem to be a band of people out there suggesting that you "stay home and keep the doors locked at all times" For heavens sake, not all Filipinas are scammers and i would be extremely dissappointed if there were'nt some left who hold true to their values.Life is a gamble in many ways and if you wish to participate in life you can't do it by staying locked up at home.I've seen both sides but for the life i have now, the ride was worth it.

[billten]

I've seen both sides but for the life i have now, the ride was worth it.

Nice...

[bows00]

I would like to know more information on how you were scammed by your first girlfriend (wife?). It is in the details that we can have a "lessons learned" experience.

[i am bob]

I have to admit - I learned a lesson on here too! When I first started mentioning that I had a "special someone", I would often get people warning me about scammers and users... Of course I had already read all about that on this forum and several other sites I would peruse before I found home (this forum)... I had also written to a few other women along the way and got pretty good at picking out scammers and users from their letters... My SS (Special Someone) was not suppose to be a romantic liason - she was suppose to be just a penpal! Someone I could talk to and ask questions of... To find out more of what the locals were like! And I was very attentive to answers I received from my SS when were were emailing each other - usually 3 or 4 times every 2 days or so... So, once things started turning into more of a relationship, here I am starting to look for signs of being scammed... You know... Does she ask for money? NO! Is she using me for a ticket out of the country? NO! She still has a few years to get her docorate - which I am the one gently nudging her towards rather than just her degree for now. And NO she is not asking me to pay for her schooling... She asked me earlier this week (since we both feel that we will be married soon) if I minded her working during her summer break... She really does love to work! The lesson I learned? Not everybody is out to scam you! Listen to what others have to say but then you also have to listen to your instincts... Not just your big head, and only a little to your little head.... Listen to the voice inside you!!!

[Tukaram (Tim)]

*well he got here and nobody held him at gunpoint.Its sad to think that filipinas will go that route just to extort money from foreigners and sadder for those who are really trying to make it in this world and be discriminated as such.

The problem is that we hear so many horror stories you start to think everyone is bad. I know there are good and bad people anywhere you go but it is so hard to tell who is who. I try and take people at face value until they show me a reason not to trust them. But when getting emotionally close it gets tougher. I mean, I'm 48, overweight, gray haired, and because of health problems I'm basically old before my time. So I have to wonder why any younger woman would be interested in me other than money? I am probably doing a disservice to them and to myself by questioning too much sometimes. (I am also friendly, nice, happy, and generous so maybe they just have good taste and are not as superficial as I am?)I wouldn't listen to any warnings from friends or family here in the States because they have no idea what Filipinos are like. But I do try and listen to expats and learn from their experiences. But in the end you have to trust your heart.

[Dzighnman]

I would like to know more information on how you were scammed by your first girlfriend (wife?). It is in the details that we can have a "lessons learned" experience.

To clarify one VERY important point... the scam I fell into was NOT played on me by my now wife... it was a GF I made when first there in Cebu for work, Michelle. It is not too much different than a thousand others I have heard since.... we were out on a weekend night out and I met a friend of a friend at Sunflower, which at that time was called H2O. The main point that I contribute to my gullibility was that I never anticipated being in the Philippines, and never did any research, never joined any forums... this was, to me, a trip to just another country for just another contract. What suckered me in was many of the same things that I fell in love with my wife over, caring, loving, unselfish and an honest emotional connection.. .well, honest on one side. We dated often and I am one that respects and trusts first, until proven to me it is not deserving. (my lesson learned was to be more suspicious before trusting blindly).Let me see.... I was in and out of the Phiilippines for months at a time,in and out every few weekes. I recall, one of my times out, I got a frantic call... father had suffered a heart attack and the only way he could be saved required a deposit at the hospital.. BAM, there went a transfer. (amounts not important really)...In my mind, relationships are based on trust... how do you ask for proof papa had a HA and still have trust? Scammers absolutely COUNT on that characteristic in a foreigner.. trust before proof. I returned to see the father had miraculously recovered and was plowing the field... everyone in the family was so happy I was able to help save him... (in hindsight, they may have been thanking me for buying them a warehouse of red horse for all I knew)... next time, purse snatched, need a new cellphone or cannot call you.... and that jewlery you bought me... gone also, so we buy another.... brother was killed in a jeepney accident and no money to bury him.. (never did see the brother again)...many times wearing rags so I bought new clothes when we were about town.I had never been so close to real poverty in my life and thought I was "helping"... boy was I. Then one time ... staying with her aunt for one of those non-work visits and I had hidden my cash reserves really well... but when we returned, they were gone... nothing else, only my cash reserves...still, she was an academy award winning actress.....It was when I left after that day that I could not pursue this relationship any longer and called it quits with her... still she called and the crying... and the sobbing.. .and it was painful as I WANTED to believe her... but in the end, what I really wanted was to not believe I could have been fooled so easily... and once the anger and shame set in, I could not feel sympathy for her any longer and it was over for good...... I said to HELL with this BS, this country is F'd. And for awhile I hated going back there... but in the end, the best therapy for me was to face the scores of Filipinas that all looked like scammers to me... until reason set in and I eventually could not extend my grudge from that one scammer to all those innocent women.. with the beautiful smiles and great personalities... and when I opened back up, I met my now wife... and my lesson was complete.... as Bundy said, "I've seen both sides but for the life i have now, the ride was worth it." No truer statement could be made about my journey.... my wife, combined with all my life lessons is what makes life now so freaking great.. . every minute of every day!!I am not sure if hearing another testimonial detailing the same age old scams is helpful, but you asked for the details...the lesson I feel is here is to not allow one evil person to cloud your vision for too long.. .get over it and learn the hard lesson then get back in to life. As for the advice I did not listen to????? Another female from the group whom I feel I sort of overlooked her interest in favor of Michelle.... told me she was "not good"... I felt that was a jealousy motivated ploy... My co-workers voiced alot of concern and they did not even know about the money I was spending... again, I felt that they were not seeing the whole picture.. turns out I was the one not seeing the whole picture..... Here is a kicker for the story.. about 3 months ago, I got a FB friend invite.... it was her, different name, but the photos were absolutely her, asking me if I remembered her.... I could not hit the delete button fast enough! :mocking:

[Dave Hounddriver]

I had also written to a few other women along the way and got pretty good at picking out scammers and users

First, this is not meant to be aimed at Bob, its a generic observation. In my life I have noticed that 90% of my friends and acquaintances will always, always, always say and believe the following 3 things:I'm a good driver.I'm a good cook.I'm good at judging a person's character.and then the other which I wasn't going to mention but what the heckI'm pretty good in the sack.Now realistically, although almost everyone I know says these things, the truth is that they are not. Myself included. A 'good driver' makes a professional driver shake his head but politely say nothing. A 'good cook' simply means I don't go to visit as often as I will be pressured to try the latest creation. A 'good judge of character' is a scammer's dream come true. The wise ones will learn their own strengths and weaknesses and not be blinded by well meaning flattery from friends or self delusion.

[wingmanPI]

IMHO there is no "set path" on how to deal with all that the philippinesbrings into our lives. Generally speaking I think the best advice is fornewbies is to move slow and lay out a number of "tests" for the filipinayou think is the one. risk small amounts of money before you open thevault.It is so easy to just tell all the newbies dont give any money, dont trustanyone and be paranoid 24 hours a day but that really is not practical.After some trial and error I believe that I have developed patience whichis by far the most important requirement in finding out if you have a girlyou can trust or not.Let experiences and how she deals with the experiences over time tellyou how things will be long term. Also risk a small amount of money inorder to save a HUGE amount later. If I lose say $100 or $1,000 USDon a "test" then that is a small amount to pay to find out what the deal is.Being very aware and having a good memory is helpful as well. With thatbeing said there is no way to protect yourself 100% unless you just nevertrust anyone with anything, I think I have a girl I can trust but the reality ishow do I really know what will happen over the next 20 years? I don't.All I can do is spend a couple of years (which I have) to make sure I feellike I have a good chance at things turning out correctly. A little commonsense, A BACKBONE and separating emotions from logic will get youwhere you need to be in PI.