Living Or Existing

[Demeter]

I was reading on a Philippines forum the other day,anyway a new member posts that he wanted to live in the Philippines and he should be able to make $250 a week working on line but some weeks nothing,anyway the first reply post appears and says that $250 a week you will be living in relative luxuryIs that really true now days with the cost of everything increasing including visa fees etc ?Oh, he would have girlfriend and child to support on this money.My point of this post is to find out what is really required to live in "relative luxury".

There is a specific factor here that will give us a different interpretation of the phrase "relative luxury" and that is lifestyle.If I were earning $250 a week, giving me a monthly income of $1,000, I would say it would be more than enough for me to get by. I am only paying 5,000 pesos for my rent, my utility bills cost me almost 4,000 a month (VECO, PLDT, Water) food and other stuff (medicine, vitamins) cost me around 8,000 more or less. I don't drink, I don't gamble, I don't eat out a lot, I no longer go to the movies as I used to. With this monthly expenses, I can say I am not living miserably. There never was a day that we ran out of food in the house or we starved. If I were earning that much, I would surely be saving some of it just in case, someone in the family falls sick and for the education expenses of my daughter and I would probably get me a small vehicle.We all have different lifestyles, what one considers to be too much might not be enough for others.

Thanks for your reply,just wondering since you are Filipino,are you living a western life style or Filipino lifestyle? I should have asked in the original post for western life style as that was my interpretation of the advice given else where.

I'm living a Filipino lifestyle but loves to cook a lot at home. I just realized that eating out at fancy restaurants costs you more because you're also paying for the place but if you cook at home, you'll be eating what you like at no extra cost. I guess this is where most expats spend a lot on, eating out and drinking.

[Art2ro]

Yeah, it's not always a matter of money if one can afford a comfortable life or not, the cost of living truly depends on location, location, location! A farmer with a sustainable and self sufficient farm, with endless supply of clean well water can live without money just by relying on the earth he stands on! Where as another person living elsewhere has to rely on others to sustain his or her lifestyle just to live or exist! Who do you think will live a more comfortable life and will always have food on the table if all progress and transportation were to cease due to the worst of all calamities! Look at what wiped out the dinosaurs? Look at the people who got stranded in Iceland due to the volcano eruption, are they living comfortably? That's just my 2 cents worth of my point of view! Life is what we all make it to be weather we are living or just existing!

[Travis]

i usually live on less than $1000 a month in Cebu but i do not live a US lifestyle & do without a lot of thingsp12,000 for rentp1500 for electricp1600 for dsl & phonep650 for cablep7000 a month for food at homep6000 for eating out a few times a monthp200 for drinking waterp500 for other waterp1000 for cell loadp1500 for taxisi am sure i forgot something so the rest i put away for clothes & emergencies & misc. once a person has all the things they need to furnish their unit then it is fairly cheap to live here i know of guys who live in a pension house for p12,000 a month with cable dsl electric so they live for less than i do but i like my space & my own dsl & phone

[Art2ro]

Life styles depends on ones income or their fixed pensions after retirement! And some people are kidding themselves when they say that they can live the same lifestyle in Philippines as in their home country! If that was a true and honest statement, I wouldn't have bothered to consider in living here in the Philippines! One probably could live in both places in this state of the recession world wide where the economy has dipped at an all time low where recovery is uncertain! But it still all depends again on location, location, location and how much money one has each month to live on and where! We used to live in California, we couldn't afford to live back there now, but maybe in Mexico, Texas, Florida and or the other depressed states you know of, I could! I don't know those other states except for a few and it would probably be boring to live somewhere I'm not familiar with! I was born here in Philippines and I know what the lifestyles and cultures are and so that was an advantage for me and my wife! So, after I retired, here we are! Nuf said eh!

[Tom in Texas]

My point of this post is to find out what is really required to live in "relative luxury".

I wondered about this same question when I seriously began to consider living at least half the year in the Philippines. There are certainly posts on this and other sites which reflect monthly expenses of less than $1,000... however, there are many more around $1,500, and quite a few ranging $2,500 and above.I collected the highest cost for any item that I saw posted by anyone on this forum and several other sites. The following would seem to be the most one would ever need to spend for a very comfortable lifestyle. I hope to keep my expenses well below those listed below, however, I'd rather not give up too many of life's pleasures (hot showers, cool house, soft bed, good food, cold Coronas, etc.) just so I can live in "Paradise"... or is that an oxymoronic thought. Before the rants about living on $400/mo begin.. I repeat - The following "budget" is not intended to reflect how much it is actually necessary to spend, but rather the upper limit of what is being spent by some who have posted their expenses. Per MonthRent - 40,000Electricity (aircon, etc) - 10,000Fuel/expense (vehicles) - 3,000Propane (cooking) - 500Drinking water (bottled) - 500House water - 800Broadband/DSL - 1,000Cable/Sat - 1,000Cell phone - 1,000Local phone - 800Household Misc (bug spray, cleaning supplies, etc) - 1,000Personal care (shampoo, toothpaste, etc) - 1,000Clothing - 1,500Food (groceries only) - 15,000Food (eating out) - 9,000Entertainment (family outings, birthdays, parties) - 4,000 Entertainment (leisure travel within the Philippines) - 15,000Entertainment (local activities, hobbies, hanging out) - 2,500Annual U.S. trip to visit family, etc. (escrow) - 15,000Helpers - 5,000Insurance (health) - 2,000Medical (spend or escrow) - 10,000 Immigration (13G) - 0Family assistance - 15,000Misc - 10,000Total

[sjp52]

My point of this post is to find out what is really required to live in "relative luxury".

I wondered about this same question when I seriously began to consider living at least half the year in the Philippines. There are certainly posts on this and other sites which reflect monthly expenses of less than $1,000... however, there are many more around $1,500, and quite a few ranging $2,500 and above.I collected the highest cost for any item that I saw posted by anyone on this forum and several other sites. The following would seem to be the most one would ever need to spend for a very comfortable lifestyle. I hope to keep my expenses well below those listed below, however, I'd rather not give up too many of life's pleasures (hot showers, cool house, soft bed, good food, cold Coronas, etc.) just so I can live in "Paradise"... or is that an oxymoronic thought. Before the rants about living on $400/mo begin.. I repeat - The following "budget" is not intended to reflect how much it is actually necessary to spend, but rather the upper limit of what is being spent by some who have posted their expenses. Per MonthRent - 40,000Electricity (aircon, etc) - 10,000Fuel/expense (vehicles) - 3,000Propane (cooking) - 500Drinking water (bottled) - 500House water - 800Broadband/DSL - 1,000Cable/Sat - 1,000Cell phone - 1,000Local phone - 800Household Misc (bug spray, cleaning supplies, etc) - 1,000Personal care (shampoo, toothpaste, etc) - 1,000Clothing - 1,500Food (groceries only) - 15,000Food (eating out) - 9,000Entertainment (family outings, birthdays, parties) - 4,000 Entertainment (leisure travel within the Philippines) - 15,000Entertainment (local activities, hobbies, hanging out) - 2,500Annual U.S. trip to visit family, etc. (escrow) - 15,000Helpers - 5,000Insurance (health) - 2,000Medical (spend or escrow) - 10,000 Immigration (13G) - 0Family assistance - 15,000Misc - 10,000Total

[sjp52]

My point of this post is to find out what is really required to live in "relative luxury".

I wondered about this same question when I seriously began to consider living at least half the year in the Philippines. There are certainly posts on this and other sites which reflect monthly expenses of less than $1,000... however, there are many more around $1,500, and quite a few ranging $2,500 and above.I collected the highest cost for any item that I saw posted by anyone on this forum and several other sites. The following would seem to be the most one would ever need to spend for a very comfortable lifestyle. I hope to keep my expenses well below those listed below, however, I'd rather not give up too many of life's pleasures (hot showers, cool house, soft bed, good food, cold Coronas, etc.) just so I can live in "Paradise"... or is that an oxymoronic thought. Before the rants about living on $400/mo begin.. I repeat - The following "budget" is not intended to reflect how much it is actually necessary to spend, but rather the upper limit of what is being spent by some who have posted their expenses. Per MonthRent - 40,000Electricity (aircon, etc) - 10,000Fuel/expense (vehicles) - 3,000Propane (cooking) - 500Drinking water (bottled) - 500House water - 800Broadband/DSL - 1,000Cable/Sat - 1,000Cell phone - 1,000Local phone - 800Household Misc (bug spray, cleaning supplies, etc) - 1,000Personal care (shampoo, toothpaste, etc) - 1,000Clothing - 1,500Food (groceries only) - 15,000Food (eating out) - 9,000Entertainment (family outings, birthdays, parties) - 4,000 Entertainment (leisure travel within the Philippines) - 15,000Entertainment (local activities, hobbies, hanging out) - 2,500Annual U.S. trip to visit family, etc. (escrow) - 15,000Helpers - 5,000Insurance (health) - 2,000Medical (spend or escrow) - 10,000 Immigration (13G) - 0Family assistance - 15,000Misc - 10,000Total

[Tom in Texas]

Hi Tom, Would those prices be in Manila. I have a budget of 110,000 pesos per month and it is very close to the items you have listed. I,m in CDO. One thing I did for family assistance was put 60,000 pesos into a kitty and the families are each allowed to borrow 10,000 but must pay it back before borrowing again. I also signed them up for Phil health as none had it, That will save me some money when there is a medical issue. On my budget I go where I want and eat very good and have family over all the time for meals

Hello SJP52,These prices are from budgets posted from all over the RP, but the majority of the "high" prices came from posters in Metro Manila and Metro Cebu City.I'm fortunate in that my wife's family is "small" compared to many, so my wife is able to keep the assistance under control. We provide a set amount per month, part of which they are supposed to save for unexpected or extra expenses. When they ask my wife for more, unless it truly seems to be an emergency not of their making, they know they will receive a high-volume stern lecture on being more responsible or risk having the monthly stipend cut off. On the other hand, I'm soft-hearted and have furnished big ticket items, durable goods and education funding without them having to even ask... so its actually myself I have to police somewhat.

Well as for any item being high or low depends on the individual and there spending habits. 40,000 for a house is probably a very nice house. I pay 7,500 average for Electricity, Using 1 air con at night and 1 during the day, Shutting it off when I go out. 5,000 for helpers means you have 2. One thing you don,t have there is savings.

I agree on the "spending habits" problem. That is why I did not try to peg a "reasonable" amount for any particular item, but rather just accepted the "highest" amount for any item from a relatively complete posted budget. By looking over only complete budgets, you can rule out most of what might be a "out of the norm" spending habits... if someone is paying P200,000/mo for rent, or P5,000,000/mo expense on their Gulfstream G5, I felt pretty safe ignoring their other spending. However, if an entire budget seems to be within normal "bell-curve" spending, but lists P10,000 for electricity, I assume that to be a legitimate spending expense.Good point on savings... I did not include any... as I assume that anyone willing to spend all of their available monthly income to sustain a "relatively luxurious" lifestyle will already have some substantial savings. Certainly not a science, but I feel very, very comfortable that absent unusual expenses (liver transplant, kidnap ransom, bribes fighting extradition), any expat could live in "relative luxury" on P164k/mo. Tom in Texas

[Mr Lee]

Boss Mans post said Living or Existing, and then threw in the term relative luxury, and relative to each of us will be different. If a person lived in one rented room in someones house or a small mobile trailer back in their home country, then having their own one room apartment might be relative luxury, but if a person lives in a mansion in the US or other first world country, then IMO they will never find relative luxury in the Philippines unless they wish to pay an equal price or more here. Example, a condo in City Lights in Cebu runs 8.5 million for a 2 bedroom and around 12 million for a 3 bedroom and I still do not consider those to be luxuriously built compared to a condo of equal value in the US because those City Lights condos do not even have air conditioning for those prices and I can buy a luxurious condo on the water in Florida right now for under $200,000 US, and then when I compare the workmanship that has gone into the City Lights condos to US workmanship and materials, then the condo in Florida would be worth at least double the condo in City Lights, yet the condo in City Lights cost more and is not within walking distance to anything, whereas the condo in Florida would be within walking distance to everything, and then on top of that once you walk out of City Lights, you would again be in a third world country, whereas the in Florida, you would still be in a first world country and with little road dust and pollution. Apples and apples and not apples and oranges because living in a third world country will never be the same as living in a first world country, yet it has its own advantages. I posted in another thread a comparison of our life in Florida and our life in Cebu, and I consider both of our lives to be relative luxury, when compared to how the average Filipino has to live in the Philippines out of necessity. The luxury that we have chosen to live is eating out most days a week in both places, yet we chose to live in a lower end condo building in Cebu instead of a high end one, and a small villa in Florida rather than a large house, so I guess luxury is in the eyes of the beholder and most places that an expat would live within the Philippines would not be considered luxury to me with the exception of possibly Makati because it is still a third world country and things here are most often done in third world style, so unless you have a first world house built here by a first world builder (do those exist here?) then IMO you will have a hard time duplicating first world luxury here and you will still be in a third world country with all the pollution etc. My wife and I estimate that we spend about $1000 a month in Cebu on average but we already own our condos, so we no longer have mortgage payments on them.

So what am I saying, if a person wants to live in first world luxury, then those people probably should not consider moving to the Philippines because once you step outside your home or condo, then you will still be in a third world country in most places within the Philippines, and if you happen to be married to a Filipino who does not come from the upper echelon of society here, then your living a first world life in their third world country will no doubt end up getting you a lot of requests for money from your now extended family once they see how you live, and how you decide to deal with that will be different for each of us, but those requests may be never ending because of your luxurious life, and they may never understand your ever saying no to them no matter how silly a request they make to you. So I say for those who wish to live first world in a third would country, be prepared for some hard feeling if you ever say no, or be very rich and never say no, and is that really what retirement is all about?

Retirement to me is no pressure, so even our humble life here is seen by our family as extreme luxury because even one million pesos to most might be like ten million dollars to most average working Americans, unattainable.

I felt the need to add just one more paragraph. A person who is happy with themselves or a couple who is happy with each other, can live a simple life in a small condo or tiny house and be just as happy as a person who lives in a mansion, so the words relative luxury has a wide range of meanings for each of us.

Oh, and this post was not directed at any one member, just my own thoughts on life.

[Art2ro]

Tom,Your figures on your estimated monthly expenditures are right on the mark give or take a few pesos! Our comfortable monthly budget is half that and the other half is set aside for unforeseeable emergencies or whatever, like home repairs, a new vehicle, a long vacation or a kick back cruise etc? Yeah, life is grand in the Philippines! We can't do it in the U.S., what we can do here in the Philippines! Art

Edited April 21, 2010 by Pinoy Art