Ponzi schemes shut down.

[chargersfan]

My sister in law called trying to get my wife to invest. She said her boss (a doctor) invested 1 million pesos with a promised return of 300,000 pesos in July. We explained to her how a ponzi scheme works. She refused to believe it could be a scam. She was offered 10,000 pesos for anyone she could get to invest. She ended up investing her entire savings of 18,000 pesos with a promised return of 12,000 pesos in July. Even after being shown all the reports that these are scams, she still believes she will get her money and prove us wrong.

[Mike J]

Duterte calls KAPA ministry a ponzi scheme and gives them a warning.  Cebu office of KAPA gets robbed and burned.  Interesting timing but most likely a coincidence.    I wonder if we will see Act II in other cities? 

https://cnnphilippines.com/news/2019/6/8/kapa-ministries-office-fire-cebu.html

Cebu City (CNN Philippines, June 8) — Authorities are looking for at least 10 armed men who robbed and burned the office building of the controversial KAPA (Kabus Padatoon Translation: making the poor rich) Community Ministry International in Compostela town, Cebu.

Town Police Captain Ian Macatangay said that 21 of its in-house employees were robbed by at least 10 armed men, who barged inside its compound in Barangay Poblacion, Compostela some 24 kilometers north of Cebu City on Saturday.

All of the 21 in-house employees were robbed of their belongings, including cellphones, laptops and cash.

The police chief also said that some of the employees claim the vault of the establishment was also carted away by the armed men before burning the building dawn Saturday.

But upon initial investigation, Macatangay said another vault was still intact at burned building. They are yet checking if there are two vaults in the establishment.

Firefighters in Compostela town recorded the fire alarm at 1:45 a.m.

Witnesses told the police and the fire investigators that the flames quickly spread throughout the building because the armed men poured gasoline all over the area.

The police said they are also trying to secure the CCTV footages if they are still usable to identify the masked perpetrators.

Macatangay said he was able to talk with some of the KAPA leaders and was told the motive might be financial, and suspects might be disgruntled officers or members of its ministry.

President Rodrigo Duterte, in an interview with religious leader Apollo Quiboloy on Saturday, named KAPA as one of the agencies that he accused of pyramid scam.

"Huminto kayo kasi 'pag sinobra, putok dito, putok doon, putok dito, putok doon. Wala akong sundalo pati pulis ganun karami. Then, let it not be said that I did not warn you. You guys in the pyramiding, pity your family and your children," he said.

[Translation: You better stop beause if you don't, things could happen. I do not have a lot of soldiers of police. Then, let it not be said that I did not warn you. You guys in the pyramiding, pity your family and your children.]

The Securities and Exchange Commission in April revoked KAPA's certificate of corporate registration for unauthorized solicitation of investments.

[chargersfan]

There is one going around that makes you sign an agreement that you are giving a donation and not money for an investment. In return, you can expect a love gift of about 30% in a couple months. Sister in law KNOWS that one is not a scam because the money goes to a pastor. If she had more money, she would donate it. She is upset that my wife won't invest so the sister in law can get the 10,000 pesos for bringing in an investor and then donate it. Too bad Phil TV doesn't have access to American TV and they can show a series called American Greed and see how many hundreds of millions of dollars are scammed each year by pyramids and ponzi schemes. 

[Jack Peterson]

36 minutes ago, chargersfan said:

. Sister in law KNOWS that one is not a scam because the money goes to a pastor.

 Sorry my Friend But.............................

[sonjack2847]

19 hours ago, chargersfan said:

Sister in law KNOWS that one is not a scam because the money goes to a pastor.

That sounds like Kapa which du30 is trying to shut down. 

[OnMyWay]

Perhaps Paul B can update us on his Casino Junket investment.  Here is one:

https://www.facebook.com/junketoperator.ph/

10 % interest per month!

[sonjack2847]

7 minutes ago, OnMyWay said:

Perhaps Paul B can update us on his Casino Junket investment.  Here is one:

https://www.facebook.com/junketoperator.ph/

10 % interest per month!

10% sounds feasible for a casino. I have a friend who has invested in payday loans and gets 20k on 100k per month and has been doing so for years. 30% will always ring alarm bells with me.

[Dave Hounddriver]

10 minutes ago, sonjack2847 said:

30% will always ring alarm bells with me

It certainly rang alarm bells with me when I went into a Philippine finance company a few years back and 30 % is what they were charging on car loans.  But that is what the finance company gets, not what the individual investors get.  The point is:  Borrowing money in the Philippines is expensive and the one lending it takes big risks of not getting their money back.  However, when it works the rewards are good.

[OnMyWay]

9 minutes ago, sonjack2847 said:

10% sounds feasible for a casino. I have a friend who has invested in payday loans and gets 20k on 100k per month and has been doing so for years. 30% will always ring alarm bells with me.

It is not really a casino.  It is junket operators.

So your friend gets 20k back on his 100k every MONTH?  That is 240% interest per year.  I don't believe it.  If he reinvested the 20k every month, here is what he would have after a year.

Month	Balance	New Balance
1	100000	120000
2	120000	144000
3	144000	172800
4	172800	207360
5	207360	248832
6	248832	298598
7	298598	358318
8	358318	429982
9	429982	515978
10	515978	619174
11	619174	743008
12	743008	891610

In 5 years, he would have over 5 billion! In 10 years he would have over 264 trillion and own the whole world!

As with all investments, when someone needs YOUR money and promises fantastic returns, I wonder:

A.  Why do they need your money if the returns are so great?  Are they already filthy rich and just being generous?  

B.  If the returns are legit and risk is low, why are legitimate investors not selling their stocks and bonds and flocking into it?

 

[Dave Hounddriver]

1 hour ago, OnMyWay said:

B.  If the returns are legit and risk is low, why are legitimate investors not selling their stocks and bonds and flocking into it?

About payday loans: Legitimate businesses do it all the time a 3 1/2% for a week. Private lenders charge more as it means the borrower cannot get a loan from L'Huillier. I doubt the returns are declared on the private lender's taxes.

There is a high risk of not getting paid back but it is covered by the profit from other loans.

It is a headache to stay on top of things to ensure that you get your money back.  It often involves demanding a debit card from the borrower and standing at the ATM on payday with a crapload of cards from different borrowers and entering all the cards as soon as the paycheck is deposited to the account.  Ya gotta be quick to get the money before the borrower takes it out and says "I forgot"

So the answer to your question is:  Most people do not want to take the risk and do the work to get those kinds of returns AND there is a limited demand for high-interest loans so the market would quickly become saturated if everyone was doing it AND the borrowers would not paying back the loans if it was easy to ignore the current lender and borrow from someone else.

Can it be done?  Yes.  I have done it myself in the past.  Too many headaches for me and in the long run the net profit is not as good as the gross profit.