Lying... For Self Preservation ( Not For Fun And Profit)

[MikeB]

If I choose to at a later date to disclose my watch costs more than the yearly salary of the average working Pinoy, I may do so.

I'm wondering why anyone would need to "disclose" that at all. Seems kind of classless to me but, then again, I wear a Timex. You're giving out lots of advice on relationships, what is the basis for your expertise on the subject?   

[Bruce]

If I choose to at a later date to disclose my watch costs more than the yearly salary of the average working Pinoy, I may do so.

I'm wondering why anyone would need to "disclose" that at all. Seems kind of classless to me but, then again, I wear a Timex. You're giving out lots of advice on relationships, what is the basis for your expertise on the subject?   

 

I am not giving out relationship advice. I am giving out advice on how not to waste time and get scammed on the internet dating sites.

 

The old Cherryblossoms and Filipinaheart formats have changed in the past few years. Fhilipinaheart now has a woman in black LEATHER(?) on their home sign in page..... Excuse me? LEATHER??? Wife material? Maybe for some... but it looks as if those newer adultfriend site clones that are popping up advertising FUN girls.... must have taken a toll on the membership of Filipinaheart so they have lowered their standards to compete. SEX sells! You want a girl friend or wife? Or a sex hook up for your 21 day stay? 

I remember back a while ago they put up a biki babe page..... Again.... do you REALLY think you are going to find a 'keeper' there (today)....

 

And, if you will recall, this forum has no shortage of posts about failed relationships and scammers and dating tricks that members have been subjected to. So I fail to understand your objection to an informative post on how to avoid being scammed or at least how to save time in wading through the gold diggers.  

 

So, again I am not giving relationship advice but how to avoid delays and scammers. I also said at the top of my original post that this may not apply to you so take a pass. So Mike B.... take a pass. But for some new members or lurkers, they may be able to use this information to their benefit.  

 

It is normal thing to ask questions of a new potiental in a dating scene. But for my money (just an expression) I still say, do not build your self up.... instead downsize yourself to see if she is really interested or not.

 

You remember those old stories / fables of the Prince dressing as a pauper to find a wife..... made sense then and makes more sense now.....

 

STOP thinking like a man.... start thinking about the women and what they and their families want.... think about how YOU present yourself and how you are preceived. You need to separate the wheat from the chaff, get past the gold diggers to get to the scincere women who want a real relationship...

 

Believe me... if a 'deer' understood scents and how dogs track those scents.... the deer would take measures to disguise their scent from the dogs.... But the deer has no idea about disguising their scent. So no matter how far they run... the dogs are behind them and closing.

 

All of my post and replies here are based on the assumption that (you) are looking for a keeper instead of a fun time gal... If this does not apply, then forget about it.

We humans do understand it, just something you need to point it out.....

[MikeB]

You didn't answer the question which is certainly your prerogative but that doesn't make it any less valid. It is relevant because it goes to establishing your own credibility. 

The basis of any relationship is trust. In my view, advocating lying at the start of a relationship is very dubious advice to say the least. However, if you have a history of successful relationships (whatever their nature) achieved by following your own advice, perhaps I'm the one out in left field. On the other hand if you don't it's reasonable to ask why you're giving advice. 

[Bruce]

I brought this over from Guy F. as he posted it today under the Why People Leave Phils.... topic. Seems to fit right in here. By 'downsizing' your position, you are less attractive to those looking for a human ATM machine to support their family....

 

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Posted Today, 05:36 PM

I know one couple who moved back here because her family made life too miserable for them by asking for money and getting nasty when enough money was not forthcoming. Another couple returned to the states to earn enough money to satisfy her family. I wouldn't want to be them.

 

************************************

 

Anothering thing occured to me is that since 'I' am being questioned here about some of my posts... I quess I should mention that I am not a creative person beyond my problem solving skills. No art or music et al sides of me. Direct linear thinking is what I do. a to b to c.... Unless it involves problem solving. Direct approach which is one reason I REALLY hate SHY.....

 

So, in reviewing my posts here, I am identifying an issue of 'how to get past the scammers and good time girls'.... to get to a women of potential 'keeper' material. Using direct information of past scams and how to identify them and get around them. Downsizing typle of lying is a valuable tool in this case.  

Edited March 25, 2013 by Bruce

[davewe]

Sorry Bruce but I have done the online dating thing quite a bit and don't agree. Now I do agree that downplaying your money (if you have any) is a good idea, but it's not lying. The truth of the matter is, for most Pinays by definition you do have money. My fiance's co-workers kid her that she has a rich fiancé. I tell her "you know I am not rich. Why do they say that?" She answered, "because you have come to the Philippines more than once. Anyone who can afford to travel here more than once must be rich." No lie on my part will break that logic. Filipinas are not dumb. If you own a car and a house and can travel, by definition you are rich - at least compared to them.

 

Lying about your marital status is even worse. When you meet the girl you actually like this will bite you big time. When I began chatting with my now fiancé, I told her I was divorced but did not elaborate. IOW I did not mention for some months that in fact I have been divorced twice. It wasn't a deliberate lie - but I still hear about it. 

 

The real issue as you rightly say, is how to tell who is ONLY interested in your money. Most women, even in your home country, are interested in what you have, what you make, what you do for a living, etc. My fiancé has a simple way to explain this and told me, "Yes, money is important. But I would never marry a man that I did not love." 

 

Now if you want to discuss strategies for how to tell who is ONLY interested in your money (for short term or long term benefit) we can discuss that, although I am sure it's been discussed before.

 

One of my guilty pleasure is watching Judge Judy. She has a saying: "If you tell the truth you don't have to have a good memory." If you lie in relationships, even if to protect yourself from bad girls - it will bite you in the ass in the end.

Edited March 25, 2013 by davewe

[Bruce]

Sorry Bruce but I have done the online dating thing quite a bit and

don't agree

 

OK, for every 'possibility' how many throw backs did you see? How many emails or messages did you get proclaiming their love for you?  

 

What year did you start trolling and when year did you stop? See any changes in that time in both the quanity and the quality of the female members?  

 

While you may disagree with my strategy of downsize lies... you do yourself see a need and method to avoid the gold diggers and women with other issues to get past before you are on the path to find Mrs. Right. It is my position that the field of internet dating has exploded with female applicants and statistically, very very few are right for (you).  

 

It has become more of a wild west format where most anything goes today as compared to the OLD days when Cherrblossoms kept a list of banned members and actively tried to protect their immage as a more wholesome site for those looking for a wife..... 

 

For those of you who have not been on a site or not on a dating site for a while, look at filipinocupid.com and see the home page and look at that women there in her black outfit...... Not a girl I would take home to mom. But then I am over 50.

 

10 years ago, that site and cherryblossoms.com would not have even allowed such a picture to be posted..... Sends the wrong image about their site. But today, got to keep up with the internet sex dating sites.... so the standards were lowered. This is what the man of today is facing in internet dating.

[Thomas]

You guys are over analyzing. You must have a system (if you do the internet dating thing) to filter out the professional boy friend seekers. Camaflouge works well. So camaflouge (lie) youself as a simple poor guy struggling to make ends meet and you can not marry anyone due to the wife back home.

 

The gold diggers will leave you alone to then look for Mrs. Right. After the time is right, then tell the potiental Mrs. Right that your name is not Tom Reid and you are not from Hooterville and that you only said so as to make sure she loved ewe for ewe and not bacause you were partnered with Al Gore when he discoverd the Internet.....

You UNDER analyzing it    :)      See what  relcarve wrote:

The gold diggers will leave you alone to then look for Mrs. Right. After the time is right, then tell the potiental Mrs. Right that your name is not Tom Reid and you are not from Hooterville and that you only said so as to make sure she loved ewe for ewe and not bacause you were partnered with Al Gore when he discoverd the Internet.....

 

I'm not so sure about that! Think of it from your own point of view. Personally speaking if a young woman told me a bunch of lies, which I believed, for whatever reason, and later came up and said- "Oh- don't worry about what I told you. I was lying, but for a good reason.  Now I'm really telling the truth."

Frankly it's going to take a lot for me to believe her now that she has admitted to not telling the truth. I think I would quickly move on. Chris McG.

Exactly!  

It can be good to WAIT telling some good parts until the gold diggers have left, 

but DON'T LIE, because of the reason you told.

OK, let me take a different approach here. In Florida..... I wear a Rolex two tone Submariner (and a Glock 23C). I have never taken that watch to the Philippines, nor any other jewelry.     Why? To lessen the 'target' appearance of myself. To better blend in (yeah right) and not draw too much attention to myself...   So, I am basically, in a form so to speak... lying.

Noooooo. That's not lying, it's wait/not telling some things, and as long as they haven't asked about that subject, you haven't lied.

 

Compare: E g I have filled several books with real life things, and I have done much different things, because I like challenges. It take long time to tell all that - and better let the woman talk some too about herself    :lol:       So I haven't had time to tell all yet. That's NOT lying...  :)

You do not want to lie??? Ok then shut up and say as little as possible about your finances..... It is for your own good....   Every one happy now? :hystery:  

Yes   :)

[bootleultras]

A little white lie never hurt no one! :thumbsup:

But then again some of the lies mentioned as being helpful are extreme, I understand where you're coming from, but the guys are right in saying that it will only cause more problems down the line .... Luckily I met my wife when we were both working together abroad so I didn't have to go through the screening process!

[davewe]

OK, let me take a different approach here. In Florida..... I wear a Rolex two tone Submariner (and a Glock 23C). I have never taken that watch to the Philippines, nor any other jewelry.

This strikes a chord for me. I am a bit of a watch collector. When I travel internationally I don't wear any of my "good" watches. But I can't not wear a watch - so I wear my $125 Seiko Monster. Guess how many compliments I have received in the Philippines about my watch? Tons. There is no sense in telling people that it is a cheap watch. They know I am a rich kano so in their minds I am wearing a rich, good looking watch. I must admit that Seiko does look pretty good on me ;)

You are NOT going to convince people in PI that you are not rich, unless you really look like a bum. What you can more easily do is convince girls that you won't give them money or will not waste your money, even if you are in a relationship.

One story: On my last trip I told my fiance that I would buy a bathing suit for her. She did not own one and we were going to meet friends at a "pool party." We went into a mall store and she started looking at suits. I saw one I thought was particularly hot and gently suggested she try it on. She did, it fit and she liked it. I took it to the cash register and paid. Cost:900p. You can't get a bathing suit at Target in the US for $25. After we left the store she asked how much it cost and when I told her she was upset and said it was too expensive and we should return it. No way, I said. Believe me, when she wore it I thought "This is the best $25 I have spent in a long time!" But for days she felt guilty over the 900p I spent.

IMO you can't avoid gold diggers simply by pretending you are not rich. What you can do is message when you might say "yes" to a request and when you might say "no."

Edited March 25, 2013 by davewe

[davewe]

Sorry Bruce but I have done the online dating thing quite a bit and

don't agree

OK, for every 'possibility' how many throw backs did you see? How many emails or messages did you get proclaiming their love for you?

What year did you start trolling and when year did you stop? See any changes in that time in both the quanity and the quality of the female members?

While you may disagree with my strategy of downsize lies... you do yourself see a need and method to avoid the gold diggers and women with other issues to get past before you are on the path to find Mrs. Right. It is my position that the field of internet dating has exploded with female applicants and statistically, very very few are right for (you).

It has become more of a wild west format where most anything goes today as compared to the OLD days when Cherrblossoms kept a list of banned members and actively tried to protect their immage as a more wholesome site for those looking for a wife.....

For those of you who have not been on a site or not on a dating site for a while, look at filipinocupid.com and see the home page and look at that women there in her black outfit...... Not a girl I would take home to mom. But then I am over 50.

10 years ago, that site and cherryblossoms.com would not have even allowed such a picture to be posted..... Sends the wrong image about their site. But today, got to keep up with the internet sex dating sites.... so the standards were lowered. This is what the man of today is facing in internet dating.

This gets into the broader issue of online dating and its pitfalls - and there are many. Is it worse today then it was 10 years ago? I don't know but it is certainly more popular. You could make the case that 10 years ago there was a good chance the good girls weren't even on the Internet, so many of the internet dating girls were bad. Today there is more general use of the Internet and webcams, and dating sites don't have the stigma they used to have.

But that does not mean you will not encounter many users and scammers online - you will. The issue in this thread you began is how best to handle the sorting process. There are a lot of pitfalls but that is true of all dating and marriage. To my way of thinking there are three types of women you have to watch out for: online scammers who will ask for money within the first few chats; girls who want you as a bf or husband for your kano wealth; or girls who might be looking for a green card.Well all three types certainly exist and the methods to ferret them out differ a bit.

For me the biggest change over the past couple years is the technology and its general acceptance. Every girl now has Facebook. Many have cams and use Skype or FB or YM to video cam (a necessity to me). Facebook gives you some insights into her life but it's no guarantee. I had one girl with multiple accounts for the different men she was involved with. While the Internet cafes are still popular more and more girls have their own laptop or family computer. The old excuse of not being able to cam with you cause she doesn't have access to a computer is fading.

I have a friend whose lived in PI for many years and has a lovely young wife. He told me that he figured there were perhaps 20% good girls for me to consider marrying in PI. I got discouraged at the small % and then he said, "But Dave, that is 20% more than the number of good girls to marry in your city!" I suspect internet dating % are similar.

I could go on and on here about what I did and what I learned from others, but back to the topic, I still maintain lying isn't the way I wish to go. In fact many girls justify their own lies by saying that all the men lie too.

Edited March 25, 2013 by davewe