Sharing between the family

[mogo51]

1 minute ago, mogo51 said:

F...k it go the full monty and buy him a golf course. (see transactonal analysis on silly responses). haha

Oops sorry, just to clarify, I did not mean your response, but the original response re putter!

[OnMyWay]

5 hours ago, manofthecoldland said:

You're a very lucky man to have married into this family. 

In order to maintain harmonty, build a good relationship and make amends for what he may well have misinterpreted as some sort of 'dissing' , I'd buy 2 or 3 and have them shipped to him wth a quixotic note that allows the both of you to save face. Build a bridge and put the ball on his side of the court. Nobody is immune to a charm offense, and people can often function on a child-like level in emotional issues that are close to them. (see 'transactional analysis' on how sometimes the adult psychological mode, switches to that of either 'parent' or 'child' at bizarre points in life that trigger unexpected emotional reactions that you don't have control over if you are unaware of it happening.)  

I may be way off target on this, but its always good to be kind to people and  make the extra effort if you think its worth it to you and your wife to improve the relationship. Your call, of course.

I've seen guys who 'aren't fun to be around', with attitude problems of their own making, respond in unexpected ways to people who take an honest interest in them.  

Yes, I am lucky with the family.

Originally, my wife told the golf club story as only about "her" not bringing the golf club, and she just recently confided that she thought I was part of it.  Certainly I am not closing the door to improving the relationship and this is really a small thing.  I only mentioned it because it it interesting  However, my wife has told me that this brother has always been standoffish with the family, and never comes to family gatherings.  Maybe because he has a peso sign on his forehead?   In any case, I probably will bring him a club next time we are in the U.S.

As I said, we don't see him often.  He barely ended up coming to our wedding and didn't stay the night.  One day trip from Laguna to Subic for our 2 pm wedding.  He did come to the reception for an hour or so.  He has two kids, son 19 (he was one of my groomsmen) and daughter 24, who is now in NZ on a student visa.  Both good kids that I like a lot.

This links into the whole Filipino gift expectations culture, and that deserves another topic.  I have a few stories about that!

[Jack Peterson]

6 minutes ago, Carlo said:

Only when your loved one is from a wealthier or educated family this will be lesser.

Sorry, I just do not agree totally with this, in my Experience they are the ones that cleverly disguise things.

[Jack Peterson]

3 minutes ago, Carlo said:

Certainly true, see Ivana Trump. However, chances are, that educated and wealthier families do not need our money as they have own income and already a system in place for the less fortunate of their extended clan. But I can only speak out of my microcosms of course.

 Which of course is just not the Case in the PI, lets not forget  this is where we are talking about.

[Dave Hounddriver]

1 hour ago, Carlo said:

educated and wealthier families do not need our money as they have own income

I'm reminded of that old axiom; How much is enough?  Just a little bit more.  It is my observation that educated and wealthier families will look for richer prospects for their daughters but they still want our money.

 

EDIT:  When I say "they still want our money" I do not mean that as necessarily negative and I do not mean that marrying into such a family is dependant on giving money.  I am simply saying that the more people have, the more they tend to think they need, or at least want.  Such is my observation of life.

Edited March 13, 2016 by Dave Hounddriver

[Dave Hounddriver]

Just now, Carlo said:

I see where this is going, so I better slowly disengage from this topic :-)

Thanks for sharing your opinions.  There is no need to disengage, so long as you can see differing opinions are not meant as arguments.  (If my post that you quoted sounds argumentative I apologize).

[Dave Hounddriver]

3 minutes ago, Carlo said:

everything I talk about and know about is from my personal microcosm

Ditto.  I understand that very well. Others who do not live my life  and know (as in have close ties with) the same people I know will never see things from my perspective.  A good friend used to tell me he lives in a bubble, here in Philippines.  He said he understood very well how things worked inside his bubble and he also understood that things in Philippines worked different outside of his bubble.  He would often say: "Don't try to burst my bubble, I am not interested in what goes on in Philippines outside my bubble".

I respected that very much and did not try to tell him anything that he was "not interested in". For me, I don't like living in a bubble.  I like to soak up information and experiences and taste many different cuts of life.  I don't want to do it all, as in I don't want to skydive out of a perfectly good airplane or bungy jump and hope the rope don't break. 

While on this forum I like to share the things I "know" (perhaps substitute "absolutely believe with all my heart") and I like to ask about things I do not yet know.  It is unfortunate when two or more people "know" something and their knowledge is contradictory.  I see that a lot among Philippine lawyers 

Anyway, this forum is a family, of sorts, and what we are doing here is sharing information between the family.  Those members who do not learn to feel part of the family usually wander off to other forums at some point.  Hope you will stay and enjoy our camaraderie 

[robert k]

We need to face that there is a broad spectrum of people in the world. At one end of the scale there are those who get satisfaction from long suffering and privation so they can give. Who would literally give you all they have and wish they could sell a kidney so they could give more, even though the person they are giving to may have more than them already! At the other end of the scale there are those to whom nothing is ever enough, literally bottomless pits of need who will gladly take food off your fork before it reaches your mouth even though they live at a much better standard than you do, because they feel entitled.

Most of us fall in between these two polar opposites. Unlike the two who seemed to be the extreme cases, those in the middle can adjust, and do adjust because we aren't going against our nature. It seems the fireworks get really bad when any and or all parties misjudge exactly who they are dealing with.

It is tough meeting people who are having a tough time and you could alleviate a lot of it in fairly easy fashion with an application of no more than 50k peso, maybe not even that much. If you do that though you may be classed as a soft touch and the requests and what some people call Dry Begging will never stop. You can even have a long discussion before you give anything saying this is a one time thing even if there is some assistance later, it is not owed, make the most of what I'm willing to do for you right now. And a taker will look at you and smile and nod while they are already planning what they will have you pay for next. You will never convince the taker that they will not get anything more from you and they will hold a grudge. You can't change that so be ready to deal with it.

I didn't write this for anyone else, it is a reminder to myself.

Another point is that more well to do family members may have been shouldering some of the family expenses and be delighted to see the foreigner thinking than now there is someone else to shoulder the burdens and they are now off the hook, not so? Sorry but my money came from doing without, if I had everything I wanted I would have no more money than they have, so as far as I'm concerned, things might have eased for the better off relatives but it has not ended. I hope they understand that and I am encouraged by the stories of people whom the greatest part of their inlaws or as some people put it, Outlaws, have an understanding of that.

[robert k]

48 minutes ago, Dave Hounddriver said:

I'm reminded of that old axiom; How much is enough?  Just a little bit more.  It is my observation that educated and wealthier families will look for richer prospects for their daughters but they still want our money.

In the US I would want any daughter of mine to marry well. I would tell her she can marry the guy with no ambition working in the warehouse but she had better be prepared to become the major breadwinner.

[robert k]

28 minutes ago, Carlo said:

my wife was asking what I am doing here and read the stuff.

She then simplified it down to a few sentences :

'We are brought up to share and care within the family, it is the only reliable structure we have in bad times. Family may have flaws and faults, but it is still the best and joyful system. As I saw (in Switzerland), you have replaced the family care with a government system of pensions and healthcare, but also pay a high price for this. At first I liked your system, but then I realized how cold the (family) atmosphere is there. I like it better in the Philippines, it is more joy to give directly to the needy in the family, than to pay the entire live into an anonymous government system. Anyway, this is how we are brought up, and it does not hurt. And abusive family members such as xx (quoting the black sheep) we also don't support."

I guess that explains a lot more than 1000 speculations :-)

The core sentence is more or less true, we in the West replaced ancient family values with a system of pensions, health Insurance and welfare for the poorest. (So did the evil commies in the former Eastern Block, joke) But of course we "pay" for that with a rather big percentage of our salaries.

And maybe also with a loss of closely knit "family joy".

 

 

 

 

As I have savings now, I see no reason to believe that I wouldn't have more had I not paid in to the government. Of course we still look out for each other in the west. I think it is pretty rare that a family just turns their back on the elderly although I know it does happen.

In ancient times I probably wouldn't have to worry about retirement. I probably would have died on a battlefield, from a missed thrust hunting a wild boar or farm accident, if illness didn't carry me off. There are N American tribes where the elderly wandered off so they would not be a burden to a tribe that was barely making it. Sort of like living in the Philippines in an area where you know the hospital will be unlikely to save you when the inevitable happens. In the US even with medicare a long illness can be devastating from the copay alone. If I had a choice of leaving my family another $300k or having me around for another year with expensive treatments, I will tell them to spend the money wisely.